Range experience

[markiver54]

Went to the local indoor range today to practice with my CCW pistol. ( SA XDS 9mm ). Had not done any indoor shooting yet, as most shooting has been at summer cabin outside. Was rather disappointed with results.

Started out shooting at anatomical target at about 15 yards firing Federal 115 gr fmj rn. Although all would have been acceptable in a self defense situation, was not real happy with 5 to 6 inch groups.

When I purchased the pistol I chose it over the M&P Shield because of the fiber optic front site that it comes with. The shield did not. The fiber that came on it is red, although, included were extra green ones as well.

Something I discovered was when I put a target out with a red bull, the front site being red as well, made target acquisition more difficult. Seemed to disappear on target. Think I am going to swap out for the green insert...anyone have thoughts on that?

Also interesting, to my surprise, is that I did better off-hand than using the bench...go figure...

[North Country Gal]

Definitely give the green a try, especially on those targets. I think you'll like it. Have a couple red dots that have a green option I can switch to and I really like it.

Interesting tidbit: the human eye is more sensitive different shades of color with green than any other color.

[Ojaileveraction]

I think your being more than a little hard on yourself.
6 inch group with a 3 inch barrel a 45 feet.
I'd take take any day of the week.
That one ragged hole at real self defense distances.

[Mags]

... was not real happy with 5 to 6 inch groups.

I think your being more than a little hard on yourself. 6 inch group with a 3 inch barrel a 45 feet.

From a 3" barrel I was thinking the same thing...

[PT7]

Went to the local indoor range today to practice with my CCW pistol. ( SA XDS 9mm )…. Was rather disappointed with results.

...target at about 15 yards firing Federal 115 gr fmj rn. Although all would have been acceptable in a self defense situation, was not real happy with 5 to 6 inch groups.

Also interesting, to my surprise, is that I did better off-hand than using the bench...go figure...

Mark,

I'd agree with Ojaileveraction and Mags on your group size. Good shooting. I had a four-inch SA XD Service Model in 9mm, and had about the same results at same distance. My sight radius may have even helped a little more being that longer barrel.

And to me, not a surprise on your shooting better off hand. That's also how I always shot mine. From my perspective, that's the best way to shoot a semi-auto.

Here is a pic of my SA XD, which I took about 6 years ago. The SA pistols are pretty darn accurate and reliable, even as mine was the base model at that time. Does this one look pretty close to your XDS?

Thanks for your Range Report
PT7

SA_XD 9MM_4-inch Service Model_0322.jpg

[dave77]

Have you shot any different smaller pistols with better results. I had a 9mm XDS and although I practiced with it a fair amount I never could shoot it very well, as in at 7 yds. I could have shots clear off the paper (target printed on std. copy paper).

Here's one of my first targets with my Beretta PX4 compact, I had a few flyers (the shot at the top was DA) but was pretty happy with most of my shots.

The XDS was definitely easier to conceal carry but I have decent IWB kydex holster for my PX4 that's fairly comfortable and another advantage of the PX4 is 15rd. capacity vs. 7-9 with the XDS. Also I really prefer carrying a DA/SA.

Don't get me wrong, many people on the Springfield Arms forum loved the way they shot the XDS but it definitely didn't work for me.

[RanchRoper]

Good on ya for shooting off hand.

[markiver54]

Went to the local indoor range today to practice with my CCW pistol. ( SA XDS 9mm )…. Was rather disappointed with results.

...target at about 15 yards firing Federal 115 gr fmj rn. Although all would have been acceptable in a self defense situation, was not real happy with 5 to 6 inch groups.

Also interesting, to my surprise, is that I did better off-hand than using the bench...go figure...

Mark,

I'd agree with Ojaileveraction and Mags on your group size. Good shooting. I had a four-inch SA XD Service Model in 9mm, and had about the same results at same distance. My sight radius may have even helped a little more being that longer barrel.

And to me, not a surprise on your shooting better off hand. That's also how I always shot mine. From my perspective, that's the best way to shoot a semi-auto.

Here is a pic of my SA XD, which I took about 6 years ago. The SA pistols are pretty darn accurate and reliable, even as mine was the base model at that time. Does this one look pretty close to your XDS?

Thanks for your Range Report
PT7
SA_XD 9MM_4-inch Service Model_0322.jpg

Yes..very similar. Mine has the more aggressive grips that I have gotten used to. Thank you for your take on it Bob...I feel better after reading your post. After all, these are self defense weapons. Appreciate your response!

[fortyshooter]

Shoot it the way you will use it...which is what you did!

Next time try it at 10 ft. and point shoot 3 shots rapid fire. In a real situation you most likely won't have much time to line up the rear sight.

[markiver54]

Shoot it the way you will use it...which is what you did!

Next time try it at 10 ft. and point shoot 3 shots rapid fire. In a real situation you most likely won't have much time to line up the rear sight.

Soo true!

[markiver54]

I think your being more than a little hard on yourself.
6 inch group with a 3 inch barrel a 45 feet.
I'd take take any day of the week.
That one ragged hole at real self defense distances.

Thanks Ojai... I feel a lo better now. Always considered myself a pretty good shot, but was questioning my abilities today. Guess I might have been expecting too much.

[markiver54]

Definitely give the green a try, especially on those targets. I think you'll like it. Have a couple red dots that have a green option I can switch to and I really like it.

Interesting tidbit: the human eye is more sensitive different shades of color with green than any other color.

Guess my first response to your post didn't make it through. Was hoping you would pipe in NCG. I AM going to swap out to the green. Will report back in after next range visit! Maybe this post should have been in " Range Reports " however, wanted to include the side arm I was using.Thanks again for your insight!

[ESquared]

Another tip for indoor range work is to start out much closer to your target.

Start out at FIVE yds, keep at it from that distance until you're happy and consistent, then move to six yds, get to the same point of proficiency, then move out to seven and so forth.

I forget the exact statistic, but the overwhelming majority of SD discharges are under 20'.

[markiver54]

Thanks for the suggestions Evan. Will try that next trip. Also gonna swap for the green sights.

[markiver54]

I forgot to mention...the guy in the lane to my left was shootong a 460. . He was kind enough though to let me know as I was getting set up. Rangemaster let me move over two lanes. Didn't help much though. Left ear still ringing even after doubling up with foam plugs and my Walker muffs...too much gun to be near indoors! Next visit will be on a more quiet day.

[BigAl52]

Mark
I hope you get it dialed in. Im like the rest don't be to hard on yourself it does take some time and practice. I like Dave though didn't have much luck with the Springfields. It has nothing to do with the gun more with me. I cant seem to get use to the Glocks either and I do fine with the Smiths.

[markiver54]

Definitely give the green a try, especially on those targets. I think you'll like it. Have a couple red dots that have a green option I can switch to and I really like it.

Interesting tidbit: the human eye is more sensitive different shades of color with green than any other color.

Finally got my green fiber optic installed today. Have not been to the range again yet, but looking at it around the house, at things I cannot shoot.. I do like it much more than the red!

[Mags]

.
ah good to hear!

... got my green fiber optic installed today....

yup done that too...

Have not been to the range again yet, but looking at it around the house, at things I cannot shoot..

[PT7]

Mark,

Been thinking about some of the SD training that my son-in-law took me through when I first started shooting. He owns a security guard business, trains his guards and helps them to qualify the KCMO LEO tests, and also does a lot of the guard duty himself. So he taught me things he knows well, and I learned to shoot at point-blank or point-shooting distance.

Two of the responses you've gotten (Fortyshooter and ESquared) suggested you shorten your distance. 15 yards is really a plinking distance, and not as much an SD position. If for instance, you faced a home invasion incident, that person will be heading your way pretty fast if a mind to. So the distance between rapidly decreases.

Wikipedia has a clear definition of point-shooting:

Point shooting — also known as target- or threat-focused shooting, instinctive aiming, instinctive firing, and instinctive shooting — is a method of shooting a firearm quickly and accurately that does not rely on the use of the sights in close quarters.

When I was a newbie shooter, I was always focused on the revolver's sights. One S&W I had was the perfect tool to practice point-shooting. I had an S&W 637 Performance Center snubby revolver; 1.875" barrel; 5-rnd; .38 SPL + P caliber. Two photos -- original wood grips, and replacement Hogue Tamer I added:

S_W PC 637 .38 Special + P.jpg

S_W 637 .38 Special plus P, Performance Center_solo.jpg

With a less than 2" barrel length, it was very challenging with that sight radius to shoot at farther distances; but would be good for close up shooting. My son-in-law set up a silhouette for me at about 4 feet, and the target looked huge from where I stood! I had a right side OWB holster, carried with a slight forward cant. First, I had to quick draw the revolver, and protect it from being grabbed at. Held it as close to my left pocket area as possible with shooting hand. Yeah, no sights to look through. I learned that the first shot is the "guide-on" round. Seeing that #1 POI, you concentrate on moving the handgun to put the next POI more on target, if needed. If you practiced, practiced, practiced, and your first POI was on target, the follow up shots would be easy.

There were a lot of new things to learn with this type of SD shooting/practice. Also had to ramp up on rapid-fire handling of the snubby without loosing the needed POI. It was challenging, and I felt some pressure doing it as if I were going through a qual exam myself! I practiced with a snubby revolver; I'd think shooting with a semi-auto would be similar to some extent; never tried it with my XD9.

Whatever it's worth, another option to consider in SD training.
PT7

Thanks for the suggestions Evan.

[markiver54]

Mark,

Been thinking about some of the SD training that my son-in-law took me through when I first started shooting. He owns a security guard business, trains his guards and helps them to qualify the KCMO LEO tests, and also does a lot of the guard duty himself. So he taught me things he knows well, and I learned to shoot at point-blank or point-shooting distance.

Two of the responses you've gotten (Fortyshooter and ESquared) suggested you shorten your distance. 15 yards is really a plinking distance, and not as much an SD position. If for instance, you faced a home invasion incident, that person will be heading your way pretty fast if a mind to. So the distance between rapidly decreases.

Wikipedia has a clear definition of point-shooting:

Point shooting — also known as target- or threat-focused shooting, instinctive aiming, instinctive firing, and instinctive shooting — is a method of shooting a firearm quickly and accurately that does not rely on the use of the sights in close quarters.

When I was a newbie shooter, I was always focused on the revolver's sights. One S&W I had was the perfect tool to practice point-shooting. I had an S&W 637 Performance Center snubby revolver; 1.875" barrel; 5-rnd; .38 SPL + P caliber. Two photos -- original wood grips, and replacement Hogue Tamer I added:

S_W PC 637 .38 Special + P.jpg

S_W 637 .38 Special plus P, Performance Center_solo.jpg

With a less than 2" barrel length, it was very challenging with that sight radius to shoot at farther distances; but would be good for close up shooting. My son-in-law set up a silhouette for me at about 4 feet, and the target looked huge from where I stood! I had a right side OWB holster, carried with a slight forward cant. First, I had to quick draw the revolver, and protect it from being grabbed at. Held it as close to my left pocket area as possible with shooting hand. Yeah, no sights to look through. I learned that the first shot is the "guide-on" round. Seeing that #1 POI, you concentrate on moving the handgun to put the next POI more on target, if needed. If you practiced, practiced, practiced, and your first POI was on target, the follow up shots would be easy.

There were a lot of new things to learn with this type of SD shooting/practice. Also had to ramp up on rapid-fire handling of the snubby without loosing the needed POI. It was challenging, and I felt some pressure doing it as if I were going through a qual exam myself! I practiced with a snubby revolver; I'd think shooting with a semi-auto would be similar to some extent; never tried it with my XD9.

Whatever it's worth, another option to consider in SD training.
PT7

Thanks for the suggestions Evan.

Thank you very much PT. You've brought some very good points and info to the table! Will keep ALL in mind next trip to the range.
I do have a friend ( ex police officer ) who offers SD training, but have not discussed price with him...maybe time to do that!
Nice revolvers BTW.