H015-243 Problems

[FDP]

Received my first Henry earlier this year and like most on this forum,the wood is great. That's about where it ends. I noticed when opening the action (breaking open) the movement was very stiff. I proceeded to do a cleaning as described in the manual. After reassembly,I noticed the tightness of opening was gone and it seemed to function correctly. I also found as others had posted the grinding or extra click in the trigger. After mounting a scope and a range session of not so good groups. 4 and 5 inch at 50 yd.from sand bags.I then used a snap cap and worked the trigger a few hundred times over a week or two with no success. I then proceeded as one poster wrote to remove the trigger assembly and worked the mechanism with some fine emery cloth.
This seemed to help a little but still had that click. I continued with the snap caps and more range sessions. I don't have an exact count but I've probably ran about 100 rounds of different ammo through it.
Then I noticed when opening the gun for cleaning the barrel to receiver movement. With the gun open,there is approximately a 1/4 inch movement side to side between the barrel and receiver. Either the pivot pin is worn or the receiver is worn.
I contacted Henry and the gun was shipped out Monday. Wondering if anyone else has seen this?

[CT_Shooter]

...I contacted Henry and the gun was shipped out Monday.

Welcome to the forum from CT. I know what a bummer it is to need to send it back for repair (I had to do it, myself), but they will make it right (in my case, they replaced the rifle with a new one). Please keep us posted. I look forward to reading more about it.

[Mistered]

Welcome to the forum.
When you say 'a 1/4" movement between the barrel and receiver' do you mean there is physical movement, side to side of the upper portion when the action was open? I.E. meaning you could 'rock' it back and forth?
Was it this way when you examined it at the LGS when you picked it up?
My point to this is a 1/4" is a huge amount of movement in this area and not something that is going to happen in just a 100 or so rounds.

[bandit1250]

I hate to say it but some of these Henry problems sound more like being on the Marlin forum. What is going on with Henry? Never used to hardly ever hear of a issue. Now it seems like people are constantly sending one back. I hate to hear of these problems and hope Henry gets it fixed. To many folks seem willing to accept the amount of guns from all the makers that will need to be returned for issues as the way it is now. I don't accept this as the way things should be. The Henry Long Ranger I recently bought was very rough at one spot in the cycling of the action but I didn't like the gun to start with so I didn't mind seeing it go down the road. I can say that I must have been lucky with the amount of guns I bought through the years I returned one Remington 541-S for a unsatisfactory blue job. Henry may be just having some issues until they get some things worked out with making so many different models in their line. I think there seems to be more center fire issues than the in Henry rim fire rifles.

[Mistered]

I hate to say it but some of these Henry problems sound more like being on the Marlin forum.

Seems to be an epidemic no doubt.
I believe Henry to be a good, customer service oriented company but looking at their web site it is a no brainer they have spread themselves way too thin and coupled with what are most likely the same labor issues most companies are dealing with its no wonder why they are experiencing these issues.
If i were the 'Commander in Chief' of Henry I would seriously look at the problem areas, sales figures and maybe 'circle the wagons' and concentrate on my target market areas.

[FDP]

Welcome to the forum.
When you say 'a 1/4" movement between the barrel and receiver' do you mean there is physical movement, side to side of the upper portion when the action was open? I.E. meaning you could 'rock' it back and forth?
Was it this way when you examined it at the LGS when you picked it up?
My point to this is a 1/4" is a huge amount of movement in this area and not something that is going to happen in just a 100 or so rounds.

Sorry ! I should have been more specific.
The 1/4 inch side to side movement is seen at the end of the barrel when the gun is open.

[Mistered]

The 1/4 inch side to side movement is seen at the end of the barrel when the gun is open.

Ok so it has to be loose somewhere to be creating this much movement.
I'll simplify this - is the 'upper' portion loose at it's pivot point with the 'lower' part?
A 1/4" is still a lot - something is dramatically wrong here.
I have a 130 year old Belgium double Barrel 12 ga. that has virtually no movement when opened.

[Yornoc3]

One thing about break action hammer guns being "looser" feeling than other break actions is that they have little to no spring tension. Since Henry rifles have no ejector, there is none. Hammerless shotguns are cocked by breaking open the action; break action guns with ejectors are also "fired" by opening the action, so they feel a lot tighter. A hammer single shot is pretty much just a barrel hanging on the pivot pin, when it's open. Any play whatsoever when closed, though, is big trouble. Still, there shouldn't be a lot of movement of the opened barrel within the action. I'd wonder about the fit of the forestock iron to the receiver if it's that loose.

[FDP]

It's in the pivot area. So much so that the bluing is rubbed from the barrel on one side by the receiver. The pivot pin was loose enough that I could push it out easily with my thumb. First thought was that the pin was to small or the receiver hole was to large but remembering back to when I first got the gun as to how stiff opening it was.
I have owned several guns over the years. My first gun was purchased in 1968 and it's still as reliable as when I took it out of the box.
Also have an old Winchester 37 single shot shotgun that was made sometime in the mid 50's. It still opens and closes tight as it did when my dad had it.
Very few new guns had to be returned for repair.
Maybe gun makers should go back to the basics like that old model 37. I know it would cost a little more but most of us would buy it and appreciate the workmanship.

[Yornoc3]

That's definitely not right. The pin should be snug enough to require a punch to tap it out. That one never should have got past quality control. Henry should replace it without question. And they should send you some other stuff for your trouble .

[tractortad]

That's definitely not right. The pin should be snug enough to require a punch to tap it out. That one never should have got past quality control. Henry should replace it without question. And they should send you some other stuff for your trouble .

The pivot pin on a Henry Single-shot is designed to be removed by lightly pushing/tapping it out - it does not require a punch. Mine comes out by pushing it with a finger/pencil eraser. There is a ball-detent on the receiver to hold it in place because it is designed to be a little loose. My 44 Single is also a little loose when it is open, but it locks up tight when it is closed. I think this is the way it is supposed to work...

[Mistered]

That's definitely not right. The pin should be snug enough to require a punch to tap it out.

No it shouldn't - a PIVOT pin should be a very light press fit to be able to be removed relatively easily.
A tight press fit pin is typically holding an internal component in and is intended to stay in place with out any movement.

The pivot pin on a Henry Single-shot is designed to be removed by lightly pushing/tapping it out - it does not require a punch.

This sounds correct.

[Henry88]

I hate to say it but some of these Henry problems sound more like being on the Marlin forum. ............ I think there seems to be more center fire issues than the in Henry rim fire rifles.

Come to think of it, bandit, it's the same with the Marlins. You seldom hear of a problem with the rimfires, Model 60 and XTs. They're all complaining about the centerfire lever actions. My XT .22 has been a great gun and very accurate.

[Yornoc3]

I stand corrected. I haven't disassembled either of mine, yet. Fortunately, it hasn't been necessary. I assume they're like driving out the pins holding the trigger mechanism in a pump or SA shotgun. I use a brass punch and light hammer for that. Snug, not press fit tight .

[Mistered]

Still, there shouldn't be a lot of movement of the opened barrel within the action.

No there shouldn't be.
For comparison I opened the action on my NEF Handi-Rifle and the movement at the pivot is probably in the 'thousands'.
Now, at the barrel end it seems like a little more due to the movement 'transmitting' out to the end of the barrel but it's still not near a 1/4".

[BigAl52]

I was out of town yesterday and not around where I could check my new 357 single shot out. But I did last night when I got home. Im not an engineer or machinist so I can only go by feel and guess. The pin in my gun has some resistance to it but can be moved with some thumb pressure. When I break open the action there is very little play at either end on mine. It is very snug.The gun breaks open freely with no resistance like I would expect a single action to do. As far as trigger pull and hammer pull goes its like Tractor Tad has described. The hammer pull back is heavier than I have experienced before but its not annoying to me. The trigger pull I could only guess at as I have no gauge. Its probably in the 7lb range but thats just a guess. I have read alot of complaints on the trigger and hammer on other forums. The only way you can change this from what I have read is do it yourself. Some guys are changing out there hammer springs for lighter ones. Its a fairly easy thing to do by taking off the pad and butt stock. They have ordered springs from a couple of different places. People who have bought the single shots and complained to Henry about there triggers are not going to get lighter triggers by sending them back. They may smooth the action up some but there not going to lighten the pull. I have never been on the liability side of a gun company but I can just imagine what might go thru that part of the business. Sure maybe the trigger is a little on the heavy side. But maybe they are erring on the safe side. Just my 02 cents worth.

[Yornoc3]

Yes, the liability fears keep the trigger pull weights up there. It almost seems like they've increased the pull weight, though, based on the chatter. My two have trigger pull weights well under the nominal 7 lbs weight of the rifles, both about 4.5 lbs, based on using a pull scale with snap caps chambered (I don't have a trigger weight gauge, either). Contrast that to a Brno Effect single shot .308, that comes with an adjustable single set trigger which, when set, reduces the weight from about 4 lbs to about 12 oz. . It's so light I have difficulty shooting it for the first couple shots, it takes some getting used to. I can't imagine using it hunting in cold weather, or while wearing gloves. I suspect the hammer spring strength is to overcome the rebounding hammer spring, to assure ignition. I don't find it to be objectionally strong, either, but I imagine that it could get tiresome in a longer range session than I put in sighting in, or hunting. I don't even remember cocking it the other day, when a deer showed up .

[Mistered]

Someone correct me if I am wrong but I was looking up some info on the SS Henry and it appears the barrel hinges entirely on the pin, meaning the barrel tang has a complete hole through it as opposed to other single shots which have a half radius in the tang for the barrel pin to pivot on and the forestock being radiused on the rear end provides the support and lockup for the barrel. In this case the forestock has to be removed to remove the barrel but the Henry simply needs the pin removed to remove the barrel. I base this on the instruction that stated the 'The rifle is disassembled by simply tapping out the hinge pin'
If this is in fact he case, and the barrel pivot is supported ONLY on the pin it wouldn't take much to mess this fit up during manufacture. As such I suspect the barrel tang is only maybe a 1/2" wide and that is not a lot of 'width' and will require a very close fitting pin to provide minimal movement when assembled - and any loose fit up at this point is going to result in what will seem like a lot of movement.

Another look at a picture of the rifle reveals the 'block' that supports the barrel has the pin hole through it and therefore should be wide enough to rest on what looks like about 2" of the pin width (I am guessing on the width) If this is the case then the barrel should be fairly well supported.

[BigAl52]

IMG_0977.JPG (98.74 KiB) Viewed 4171 times

Here is mine apart on the bench. The block on the bottom of the barrel that the pin goes thru is roughly .625 thousands according to my dial gauge. There is no need to remove the forend to take the barrel out of the stock end of the rifle.

[Mistered]

The block on the bottom of the barrel that the pin goes thru is roughly .625

SO basically 5/8" wide.
This should be wide enough to provide pretty good support but it is still going to be an area that is going to experience some wear over time but that would be negligible.
I am suspecting the OPs problem is an oversize or out of round hole in this area resulting is his excessive movement.
Its possible someone 'on the line' discovered this and tried to band-aid it by filling it with something and this resulted in the stiff opening he reported and then whatever was in there fell out and revealed the loose fit.