Accuracy-Lead VS Jacketed

[krunchnik]

Hi fellow reloaders.
I am questioning a few of you that reload as to whether you have better accuracy with your jacketed loads or your cast loads.
I scoped both of my BBB and have recently realized that my .357 and .41 Mag loads all are quite a bit more accurate with my jacketed loads.
Not by just a little either-my cast loads will print all over a 3 or 4 inch circle whereas my jacketed will print a nice little closed cluster.
I am just thinking that possibly it has more to do with velocity than bullet material.
Most of my cast loads I try not to soup them up much-although I am running Missouri Bullets hardcast I think at brinnel 18.
Just wondering what some others thoughts are.
Thanks in advance

[Vaquero]

Well, my thing is I don't have but a couple rifles that I shot both in.
Up in til a week or so ago, I could say that about my 44 BBB.
As the only truly accurate load I had found for it was a jacket bullet.
But Rifletom turned me on to load for a 250 Keith style bullet and some 2400.
Now it's running neck and neck.
Thanks Tom.

RP

[BigAl52]

Justs depends on the load. I have found both to be accurate when its paired with the right kind and charge of powder. Size of the cast bullet is important to.

[RanchRoper]

Interesting as I only shoot lead. Never put copper down the barrel.

[Vaquero]

Interesting as I only shoot lead. Never put copper down the barrel.

Same as my BBS 41.
Don't know about my 45 colt Cowboy as I bought used, but since I've owned it,
it has only seen cast.

RP

[North Country Gal]

One other factor at play with the lead versus jacketed thing for revolver cartridges is that SAAMI specs for revolver cartridges, even the 45 Colt, are for the smaller jacketed bullets, so assuming Henry is going with SAAMI specs, the bores on your Henrys may be running a little tight for lead bullets. Might be worth slugging the barrel on your Henrys.

I definitely notice this on my U.S. made 45 Colt revolvers. Ruger 45 Colts are notorious for having cylinder throats and forcing cones too small for optimum lead shooting, so a lot of Ruger 45 Colt owners open up the throats and forcing cones for better lead performance. Interestingly, my Uberti 45 Colts have cylinder throats and forcing cones that are perfect for shooting lead, right out of the box. Have heard from the cowboy action crowd that Italian made 45 Colts are optimized for shooting lead.

[krunchnik]

I am kinda thinking considering they shoot so well with jacketed I may just designate a couple of those loads for my rifles only.
I have Ruger New Model Blackhawks in both calibers and those perform respectably with hard cast.

[Rifletom]

Like RR, I've never run jacketed bullets thru my .45 Colt Henry; only cast. In my .357 BB brass rifle, it was 158gr MB coated RNFP or 158 XTP's. Both pretty darn accurate at 50, 75 and 100 yards. 50 yards is where I usually shoot. But, once I got a hold of those 180gr coated bullets from Missouri, well, everything changed. For the better. May want to try those, and if you do, ask one of us here and we'll send you the load.

[JEBar]

One other factor at play with the lead versus jacketed thing ....

another factor, for me, is the desire to keep bullet trajectory as flat as possible over whatever distance I anticipate firing .... I have found that flatter the trajectory, the smaller my groups and that is specially true at longer, unknown ranges .... in short, for hunting I've always been a strong believer in the "speed kills" school of thought .... the longer that distance, the higher muzzle velocity needs to be .... for rifle distances, that mandates the use of jacketed bullets

[Vaquero]

Sorry JEB, but Big ole Fat slow Boolits get it done all the time.
I know you have a 45-70, ain't nothing flat shooting about that cal.,
unless you are shooting short distances. Unlike a 444.

RP

[Ojaileveraction]

Apple to oranges.

[JEBar]

Sorry JEB, but Big ole Fat slow Boolits get it done all the time. I know you have a 45-70, ain't nothing flat shooting about that cal., unless you are shooting short distances. Unlike a 444.

RP

no doubt about it, Big ole Fat slow Boolits get it done .... the only ones I've every hunted with are 240 gr Nosler JHP's .... I load my hunting ammo to deliver a relatively flat trajectory ....

+.2" at 25 yds

+.7" at 50 yds

0.0" at 75 yds

-2.2" at 100 yds

it has served us well on black bear, boar and deer .... longest shot taken less than 75 yards .... I've never hunted with our 45-70 and sadly, the reality is, I doubt I'll ever have an opportunity to do so .... if something totally unexpected happened and I was able to hunt elk and other big game again at longer ranges , I'd be hard pressed to not carry our 300 WBY Mag .... our hunting level 180 gr Noslers are still traveling faster at 300 yards than the same bullet out of a 30-06 at the muzzle .. ..

[JEBar]

Sorry JEB, but Big ole Fat slow Boolits get it done all the time. I know you have a 45-70, ain't nothing flat shooting about that cal., unless you are shooting short distances. Unlike a 444.

RP

nothing to be sorry about ..... no doubt about it, within their ranges, Big ole Fat slow Boolits get it done .... the only ones I've every hunted with are 240 gr Nosler JHP's .... I load my hunting level 44 Mag ammo to deliver a relatively flat trajectory ....

+.2" at 25 yds

+.7" at 50 yds

0.0" at 75 yds

-2.2" at 100 yds

it has served us well on black bear, boar and deer .... longest shot taken less than 75 yards .... I've never hunted with our 45-70 and sadly, the reality is, I doubt I'll ever have an opportunity to do so .... if something totally unexpected happened and I was able to hunt elk and other big game again at longer ranges , I'd be hard pressed to not carry our 300 WBY Mag .... our hunting level 180 gr Noslers are still traveling faster at 300 yards than the same bullet out of a 30-06 at the muzzle .. ..

[220]

In my experience it is easier to find a jacketed load that shoots well in your rifle than it is to find a cast load.
That isn't to say you can't get cast to shoot well just that it will probably take a lot more load development to find a load that does so consistently.
Took me a lot of testing to get consistent 1-2" groups at 100y with cast.

[Mistered]

That isn't to say you can't get cast to shoot well just that it will probably take a lot more load development to find a load that does so consistently.

Ditto this.

Some will simply 'stumble' on a cast load that shoots excellently but most of the time it can be frustrating and require development.

Some will start loading cast and and get 'adequate' accuracy, think its the best their rifle will shoot and continue to use that load and never try jacketed which might surprise them it they did. I would say anyone using cast consistently should at least try some jacketed as a 'control' and see what their rifle is really capable of.

My experience is cast bullets tend to consistently shoot better out of handguns than rifles.

I am going to order a box of Oregon Trail Laser Cast in .357 158 grain SWC and try to work up a load for my BBB again.

[krunchnik]

Found both of my rifles are much more accurate using jacketed bullets-I am getting really nice groups in the .41 Mag and the .357-but the slower cast are opening up by quite a bit.
For my .41 I am sticking to 210gr Speer or Nosler and the .357 are 158gr also Speer or Nosler.
I ordered 500 Speer 210gr Deep Curl-going to find out how well these shoot.

[Rifletom]

krunchink, a lot of good and interesting answers here. I think Al and RR answered towards the cast shooters; which would include Vaquero and myself.
But, if you're getting better accuracy from jacketed, then, by all means, use them. Are these for hunting or plinking/range work? Mine are all for plinking/range shooting. And not more than 75-80 yards. Honestly, I probably shoot cast or coated cast for the economics and they are more than accurate for MY needs. I have found the Missouri 158 and 180 rnfp plenty accurate with my loads. Especially the 158 coated at 100 yards.
Again, nothing wrong at all with jacketed, I just like cast. I can get 'em pretty accurate for my plinking needs. I hope this helps a bit.

[Mistered]

Lets not forget plated cast which in my experience accuracy rivals that of jacketed.

Reality being what it is unless someone really feels the need to use jacketed, plated is by far the best option and only slightly more expensive than 'plain' cast.

Plated bullets are a win-win option we have today that we did not have in the past.

[Rifletom]

Lets not forget plated cast which in my experience accuracy rivals that of jacketed.

Reality being what it is unless someone really feels the need to use jacketed, plated is by far the best option and only slightly more expensive than 'plain' cast.

Plated bullets are a win-win option we have today that we did not have in the past.

They can be; just don't run them as hot as a jacketed if you need speed for some reason.

[Mistered]

just don't run them as hot as a jacketed

I don't - I load them typically as plain cast. Been using them since their inception actually.