The American Airlines/New Mexico UFO incident....

[fortyshooter]

Was on all the news the other day about the pilots aboard American Airlines flight over New Mexico seeing a large cylindrical object fly fast over their plane. Of course the FAA control radar never showed the object but the FBI is aware of it. Being within couple hundred miles of an Air Force test range the Air Force denied any testing of craft at that time.
Wonder what it was?

[cooperhawk]

I've never actually seen a UFO with my own eyes, but in my 32 year as an Air Traffic Controller I was involved with numerous incidents with pilots and folks on the ground reporting such sightings. There are several books written on the subject. A couple of years ago, without fanfare, the Trump administration admitted the existence of UFOs as well. I do believe the exist.

The last incident I recall was with a Northwest Orient 747 that departed Minneapolis for Seattle. I was controlling the high altitude sector which included Western Minnesota and eastern North Dakota. The aircraft was still climbing out when they asked me if I had another aircraft directly under them. That's a Controllers worst nightmare having two aircraft in the same proximity. But I did not. He said that their aircrafts ground proximity radar was painting something directly under them.
(The ground proximity radar is installed in the aircraft as a landing aid, telling them how far they are from the ground as the descend to land).

After I replied in the negative he started to sound very concerned and radioed that he was going to make some shallow turns left and right in an attempt to clear the object, but as he did the object turned with him as if in formation. Now the crew was getting spooked.
I had an Air Force Nightingale, (a C9 hospital air craft), that had just departed Fargo and was on a course that would cross under the Northwest, so I leveled the Northwest and asked the C9 to pass one thousand feet under him. I had also brought up the primary radar to try and get a paint on the object, but all I could see was the large image of the Northwest.

Normally in the high altitude sectors we used only what we called secondary radar. Secondary radar involves a transponder aboard the aircraft that intercepts our radar signal, codes it and returns it. Using that system we didn't have to sort out all the primary ground clutter from our aircraft. About ten miles from merging the aircraft I observed a primary painted object dash away from the Northwest at a very high rate of speed. The Northwest reported the object was no longer on their radar and the C9 saw nothing.

That was just one incident. I could relate many more, but you're probably already bored. At first we were discouraged from reporting them, but after while they said to go ahead, but the reports were just ignored.

I am a believer.

[Hatchdog]

Coop not bored at all. Not only an interesting and spooky story but a great overview of radar for us uninformed. On the most recent incident I heard that the pilot asked ground control if the military had a target up. Can’t imagine that commercial aircraft would fly anywhere close to a target range.

[BigAl52]

Coop I know and am sure your job was high stress. But I would really think it would be a cool job at times. My dad worked 32 years at United Airlines and I always had a great interest in planes still do. Not sure if you do as anything that is done to much becomes something of less interest. IE I could care less if I ever see the inside of a tractor trailer again. But I do believe in the UFO things and have always been interested in the storys.

[cooperhawk]

Under the title "stuff happens", I have known military aircraft to accidentally launch a missle which flew close to a civilian aircraft. It was reported to me by some shook up pilots, but the military never acknowledged it. Not supposed to happen, or even be possible to happen, but it does from time to time.

The Air Traffic Control System is multi layered. Aside from the primary radar system used for low altitude, and the secondary radar system used for high altitude, there is another system manned by the military. Now while all aircraft operating in the US, including military, are controlled by the FAA, The Air Force also tracks certain targets of interest with their own radar. For instance when an aircraft from a communist country operates within the boundaries of the US, they are tracked.
When one would depart a US airport the controller would call the Air Force unit covering the area and coordinate a track with them. Phraseology would be something like this, "Giant Killer Washington Center Cat Track commie block", then the Air Force would track that aircraft on their own even though the FAA controls and communicates with it. Cat means "Civilian Air Traffic".

The bottom line is that the military knows where their air craft all the time.

[Koyote]

High speed drones...shhhhhhhhhhhhh!

[cooperhawk]

This stuff used to be classified, but it's not anymore. I have listened to tapes of fighter pilots engaged with a UFO on their tail that they cannot get away from. I've heard them begging for help. I've read reports of fighters launching after UFOs that never returned. That was a fighter out of Andrew's AFB. They think the wreckage may be in the Wilderness area between Washington and Richmond. His last call was, "I'm closing".
There we an incident when I was working on the East Coast where four counties came together in a mountain valley, and all four Sheriffs departments were on the phone with us reporting this object floating up and down the valley. I peaked up the primary radar and actually painted the object. Thousands of people saw it. No idea what it was.
I knew about the SR71 years before LBJ leaked the information accidently.
I knew almost the exact minute the Gulf War would begin.
Sometimes the knowledge was a burden lest one would accidently release it and get in serious trouble.

That was a long time ago.

[Grunt67]

Dont forget the best know incident in Roswell in the 40s. Of course, it was covered up.

[fortyshooter]

Very much appreciate your actual expierences as an air traffic controller Coop...lots of great info.! I have always had an interest in the UFO's since the 60's. Interesting that nothing has shown up on our missions to Mars with all the pictures but then anything of note would be censored out by NASA

[cooperhawk]

Dont forget the best know incident in Roswell in the 40s. Of course, it was covered up.

Well, myself I suspect that the Roswell incident was actually an Air Force weather balloon.
I know, I've read all the books and have seen the movies on it as well, but the govt made public all
the reports of this kind of thing a couple of years ago, and there was no mention of it. I think it might
have been just a good opportunity to get attention and make a lot of money. I could be wrong though.

[cooperhawk]

Interesting that nothing has shown up on our missions to Mars with all the pictures but then anything of note would be censored out by NASA

Well, there were some encounters between astronauts and UFOs. I'd have to go back and research it again, but they have reported objects flying along beside their space vehicle. The problem is that when this happens if often can be attributed to something that naturally occurs, such as reflections, space debris, ect. For that reason the authorities keeps it quiet so as not to appear as fools until it can be explained. Of course it can't always be explained.

I've often thought of writing a book about all my experiences, but now one would probably believe it.

[Oldbrass]

How long was the SR71 spyplane in existence before the public knew, How many reported that as a UFO ? Lord knows what's out there now. The discovery channel had an episode on nazi tech developing anti gravity devices, that was over 75 years ago.. Granted it's TV conspiracy but who knows (somebody) does

[RanchRoper]

Closer look...

[Grunt67]

Dont forget the best know incident in Roswell in the 40s. Of course, it was covered up.

Well, myself I suspect that the Roswell incident was actually an Air Force weather balloon.
I know, I've read all the books and have seen the movies on it as well, but the govt made public all
the reports of this kind of thing a couple of years ago, and there was no mention of it. I think it might
have been just a good opportunity to get attention and make a lot of money. I could be wrong though.

IMHO, the government makes public what they want, and whatever version they want. Personally, I don't buy the weather balloon version. That was their 2nd version at the time.
To each his own.

[BigAl52]

They have some good burgers RR. Coop I bet one could spend some serious time listening to the storys of all of the years you were in the tower.

[markiver54]

Closer look...

At least it looks like they come in peace!

[GunnyGene]

How long was the SR71 spyplane in existence before the public knew, How many reported that as a UFO ? Lord knows what's out there now. The discovery channel had an episode on nazi tech developing anti gravity devices, that was over 75 years ago.. Granted it's TV conspiracy but who knows (somebody) does

Back around 1971/72, while stationed at Futema USMC base on Okinawa, I read an article in Time magazine. Said there were only 3 SR-71's in existence, and 2 of them were experimental or assigned outside of the military. There were 6 stationed on Okinawa that flew nearly every night on missions over China and other areas of interest.

[cooperhawk]

Back around 1971/72, while stationed at Futema USMC base on Okinawa, I read an article in Time magazine. Said there were only 3 SR-71's in existence, and 2 of them were experimental or assigned outside of the military. There were 6 stationed on Okinawa that flew nearly every night on missions over China and other areas of interest.

They were wrong. There was a wing of them flying out of Beale AFB in California. They also had another wing of YS12s that they build as interceptors and never deployed. There was never an adversary for them. When I first reported to the control floor as a trainee in 1968 I saw this track on the radar and asked the controller what the heck that was. He gave me the old reply that if he told me he'd have to kill me. Then he laughed and told me. It was an SR that came in from the west coast, started his turn back to the west over Charleston, WV, and rolled out over Charleston, SC, west bound. He was clocking over 2000 MPH and his altitude was above 60 thousand.

After the training time they were deployed to various hot spots around the world.

It was LBJ who exposed them to the world.

A funny thing was that they had to descend down to normal altitudes to refuel. They were very thirsty. What we did was something we called a "dipsy doodle". In other words we blocked altitudes above and below the tanker, (a KC135), as the 71 had to descend below the tanker and then climb back up to bleed off enough air speed to hook up. It did happen that air line crews spotted something strange while they were refueling and reported it. We played dumb.

[cooperhawk]

Coop I bet one could spend some serious time listening to the storys of all of the years you were in the tower.

Funny thing is I never worked in a tower. I worked in an Air Route Traffic Control Center. There are 21 of them in the conterminous US. I started off in the one located in Northern Virginia and finished my time in the center just south of the twin cities.
Centers control ALL of the air space, and delegate air space around and over airports to Approach Controls and Towers. Towers and their radar room, (if they have one), usually control a thirty mile radius of the runway and the altitude up to 23 thousand feet.
As a Center Controller I also controlled the small airports that have no tower using remote radio transmitter/receivers. We had several remote radar sites and all this data was available to me through a series of micro wave towers and underground land lines.
Washington Center controlled Virginia, Maryland, Parts of Pennsylvania, West Virginia, North Carolina, Georgia and some Oceanic areas.
Areas and traffic flows were broken up into manageable sections or sectors of air space and during busy times a three man radar team would operate it.
The sectors then were separated by altitudes usually Low, 23 thousand and below, and High, 24 thousand and above.

The military is delegated air space around certain bases, just as an Approach Control would be. Outside of that air space all AC are controlled by Centers.

Are your eyes glazing over yet?

[cooperhawk]

If it sounds complicated, it really is. It was extremely hard to qualify as an Air Traffic Controller and a lot of folks went by the way side trying.
On the other hand, it paid extremely well!
I mean extremely well.