hello from Colorado

Discus420 · Post by **Discus420** » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:25 pm

I just got my first Henry and I am trying to learn all I can on this gun. Its a Navy Arms Henry that was made in the USA I tell people this and they laugh at me saying its made in Italy and was a Uberti. This has no Italian Proof marks nor does it say anything about Uberti or Italy Its a 44-40 with a 24.25" barrel its nice I really like it. I wish I knew more about it and also what its value is.

Here are some pics :

https://imgur.com/a/7LBNrNG

Post by **PT7** » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:38 pm

_WELCOME!_.jpg

Very nice rifle you have there, Discus. When you dig up some interesting facts and/or history on it, do share it with us. Always interesting to get such background. Bunch of cool-looking photos, too.

Enjoy your time on the Forum.
PT7

Post by **BigAl52** » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:46 pm

Welcome from Colorado. New Haven Arms made about 3000 Henrys here under the Navy Arms name. But I read that the ones made here had 2 screws that held on the side plates. The ones made by Uberti only had one like yours appears to have. Maybe someone else will chime in that knows alot more than I do. But your rifle looks good.

Post by **JEBar** » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:53 pm

as best I can remember, some Navy Arms rifles were chambered for 44 wcf / 44-40 cal ... to check open the bolt .... if there is a hole in the center of the bolt face its center fire .... if it is a rim fire, the firing pin will be well off center,and will be rectangle in shape .... you have a modern made .44 Henry rim fire rifle .... they were among the first replicas offered in the 1960s .... the US government supposedly permitted their sale WITHOUT GCA68 paperwork as they were in the original caliber and as the .44 Henry rim fire had not been available in the commercial marketplace for fifty years ... the government then changed their mind and decided that as a cartridge gun, it would have to be papered .... Navy Arms then decided to make them in .44-40, to boost sales .... the .44-40 is a larger case than the .44 Henry rim fire, so you would need to do more than just get a new bolt. I would not do ANYTHING as it is probably worth far more just the way it is .... BATF has all the records for guns from the NJ factory that closed in 2002

Post by **Mags** » Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:13 pm

Those made in Italy are stamped:
"NAVY ARMS CO. RIDGEFIELD N.J. MADE IN ITALY”.

Also note screw pattern differences
Italy

madeinitaly.JPG

USA

sQbzX1x.jpg

AND, welcome to the forum from the TV Oregon.

Discus420 · Post by **Discus420** » Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:33 pm

Mags wrote:Those made in Italy are stamped:
"NAVY ARMS CO. RIDGEFIELD N.J. MADE IN ITALY”.

Also note screw pattern differences
Italy
madeinitaly.JPG

USA
sQbzX1x.jpg

AND, welcome to the forum from the TV Oregon.

So I 'm not crazy this was born in the USA!

Post by **BigAl52** » Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:11 pm

Nope your not crazy after a second look by myself its born in the USA I didnt look far enough in the pictures your provided

Mistered · Post by **Mistered** » Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:51 pm

Welcome from Wickiup Junction Oregon AND you have a VERY rare and valuable rifle - One of the early replica Henrys made by Val Forgett, the founder of Navy Arms. His is an interesting history and he (Val) is considered the 'father' of the modern replica firearms industry. Below is a good synopsis of the company.

The Henry Repeating Rifle is a very interesting weapon and one of the most outstanding weapons to come out of the Civil War. As with a lot of projects my book “The Henry Repeating Rifle” is an ongoing project where new and additional information surfaces. This additional information has surfaced since I originally wrote “The Henry Repeating rifle” back in 1992.
Today reproduction Henry rifles are made by Uberti in Italy and imported into the United States. As of this date they are the only company that manufacture the Henry rifle. However that was not the case back in the late 1970s and into the early 1980s. Navy Arms manufactured the first reproduction Henry rifles. These were manufactured in the United States, not Italy. These are truly American made Henry rifles as were the originals which were produced by the New Haven Arms Company which later became Winchester Firearms. In an e-mail dated June 7, 1999 Val Forgett, president and founder of Navy Arms, confirmed this to me stating “yes the first Henrys were made in the United States-manufacturing was then moved to Italy by Uberti.” Navy Arms produced a limited edition of 50 Henry rifles marked .44 RF. These Henrys had the correct two-prong firing pin and were rim fire. I have been able to look at one of these Henrys. The owner of this Henry purchased a center-fire bolt and replaced the rim fire bolt and began shooting his with .44-40 ammunition and blanks. There was also another limited edition of 500 Henry rifles as well as a limited edition of 1000 Henry carbines with a 22 inch barrel. All of these were chambered for the .44-40 cartridge. I have been told by others that there were a couple of other limited edition runs of Henrys by Navy Arms. Navy Arms manufactured Henrys likely number less than 3000. The Navy Arms Henrys are also different from the Uberti manufactured Henrys. The carriers will not interchange. The side plates of the Navy Arms Henry are held on by two screws while Uberti only uses one screw. The trigger spring on the Navy Arms is an internal two-prong trigger and safety spring while the Uberti Henry has an external trigger spring. The Navy Arms Henry does not have the magazine lock to prevent the magazine from just being twisted open and ruining the magazine spring. The Navy Arms Henry and the Uberti Henry are indeed two completely different guns. The cost of Henrys sure has skyrocketed. The current retail price, as of this writing, for an Uberti Henry is between $1100 and $1200. The retail price for the reproduction Henrys when they were first introduced by Navy Arms was $500.

Post by **RetiredSeabee** » Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:48 am

Welcome aboard, congrats on the rare beauty.

Post by **CT_Shooter** » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:36 am

Discus420 wrote:I just got my first Henry and I am trying to learn all I can on this gun.

Welcome to the forum from CT. Thanks for sharing your story and those great photos.

Les · Post by **Les** » Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:37 am

Hello .... welcome to the Forum from Runcorn, UK!

Ozarkridgerunner · Post by **Ozarkridgerunner** » Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:25 pm

Hello and welcome from the Ozarks. Your post sparked my interest so I did a search for Navy Arms Henry .44 Rimfire. Found a website forum , cas city. It's a Cowboy Action Shooting forum. Lot of good and seemingly knowledgeable info there as well. One gentleman allowed as how there were only 50 of the .44 Rimfires made in the USA. The rest were chambered in .44/40. Later some were made in South America but they would be stamped to indicate that. Sounds like you have a rare firearm there indeed. I don't have the link just the website name , should be easy to pull up and check out the discussion there as well. Also check out the Blue Book of Gun Values to help you on your inquiry as to value and it will usually give some manufacturing dates and history as well. Congratulations and good luck.

Post by **ESquared** » Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:01 pm

Fascinating story so far and welcome to a great forum!

The obvious question (to me, anyway) is, how did you come to possess this gun and what did the previous owner tell you about it, if anything? There has to be a back-story that would help everyone figure out the bigger picture. What seems to be the serial number would appear to be a major identifier of its lineage and age.

A pic or two of the inside of the chamber would also be great, as well as a shot or two with the hammer cocked. And, what is that "seam" that appears about 3/4 of the way down the barrel (toward the muzzle)?

The folks here have a lot of experience, but it might also be worthwhile to think about reaching out to Henry Repeating Arms in NJ, as I'd suspect they have some sort of archivist/historian who could help as well. Maybe you've already done that, but, if not, it's just a thought.

Wow, great stuff! Let's hear more about it!

Discus420 · Post by **Discus420** » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:08 pm

Mistered wrote:Welcome from Wickiup Junction Oregon AND you have a VERY rare and valuable rifle - One of the early replica Henrys made by Val Forgett, the founder of Navy Arms. His is an interesting history and he (Val) is considered the 'father' of the modern replica firearms industry. Below is a good synopsis of the company.
.

Thanks so much for that info. What would you say the value of this rifle is ?? Just a ball park figure would be greatly appreciated I have been trying to find one that sold in the last few years but no luck at all.....

Mistered · Post by **Mistered** » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:20 pm

What would you say the value of this rifle is ??

That is a tough one as it is unique in the fact that while a 'replica' it has an interesting 'historical' provenance attached to it being it is an original 'Navy' arms rifle.
Fortunately it's not a 'one of a kind' as there were 3000 +/- made as multiples of something typically help value but not having found one sold has an impact on it also - I.E. nothing to compare it to.
I would seriously contact Navy arms and ask them about it - maybe even talk to Val Forgett III - the son of Senior. This is an unusual find.

Discus420 · Post by **Discus420** » Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:12 pm

Mistered wrote:Welcome from Wickiup Junction Oregon AND you have a VERY rare and valuable rifle - One of the early replica Henrys made by Val Forgett, the founder of Navy Arms. His is an interesting history and he (Val) is considered the 'father' of the modern replica firearms industry. Below is a good synopsis of the company.

The Henry Repeating Rifle is a very interesting weapon and one of the most outstanding weapons to come out of the Civil War. As with a lot of projects my book “The Henry Repeating Rifle” is an ongoing project where new and additional information surfaces. This additional information has surfaced since I originally wrote “The Henry Repeating rifle” back in 1992.
Today reproduction Henry rifles are made by Uberti in Italy and imported into the United States. As of this date they are the only company that manufacture the Henry rifle. However that was not the case back in the late 1970s and into the early 1980s. Navy Arms manufactured the first reproduction Henry rifles. These were manufactured in the United States, not Italy. These are truly American made Henry rifles as were the originals which were produced by the New Haven Arms Company which later became Winchester Firearms. In an e-mail dated June 7, 1999 Val Forgett, president and founder of Navy Arms, confirmed this to me stating “yes the first Henrys were made in the United States-manufacturing was then moved to Italy by Uberti.” Navy Arms produced a limited edition of 50 Henry rifles marked .44 RF. These Henrys had the correct two-prong firing pin and were rim fire. I have been able to look at one of these Henrys. The owner of this Henry purchased a center-fire bolt and replaced the rim fire bolt and began shooting his with .44-40 ammunition and blanks. There was also another limited edition of 500 Henry rifles as well as a limited edition of 1000 Henry carbines with a 22 inch barrel. All of these were chambered for the .44-40 cartridge. I have been told by others that there were a couple of other limited edition runs of Henrys by Navy Arms. Navy Arms manufactured Henrys likely number less than 3000. The Navy Arms Henrys are also different from the Uberti manufactured Henrys. The carriers will not interchange. The side plates of the Navy Arms Henry are held on by two screws while Uberti only uses one screw. The trigger spring on the Navy Arms is an internal two-prong trigger and safety spring while the Uberti Henry has an external trigger spring. The Navy Arms Henry does not have the magazine lock to prevent the magazine from just being twisted open and ruining the magazine spring. The Navy Arms Henry and the Uberti Henry are indeed two completely different guns. The cost of Henrys sure has skyrocketed. The current retail price, as of this writing, for an Uberti Henry is between $1100 and $1200. The retail price for the reproduction Henrys when they were first introduced by Navy Arms was $500.

Any guesses on the value of this Henry????? Anybody? I have been trying to find one that sold in the last few years and nothing....

I will try to contact Navy Arms not a whole lot of info on these I will get some more pics this week

Discus420 · Post by **Discus420** » Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:26 pm

ESquared wrote:Fascinating story so far and welcome to a great forum!

The obvious question (to me, anyway) is, how did you come to possess this gun and what did the previous owner tell you about it, if anything? There has to be a back-story that would help everyone figure out the bigger picture. What seems to be the serial number would appear to be a major identifier of its lineage and age.

A pic or two of the inside of the chamber would also be great, as well as a shot or two with the hammer cocked. And, what is that "seam" that appears about 3/4 of the way down the barrel (toward the muzzle)?

The folks here have a lot of experience, but it might also be worthwhile to think about reaching out to Henry Repeating Arms in NJ, as I'd suspect they have some sort of archivist/historian who could help as well. Maybe you've already done that, but, if not, it's just a thought.

Wow, great stuff! Let's hear more about it!

Well I saw it on an auction site and noticed it did not have the "made in Italy" or the proof marks that Uberti puts on the rifles so I took a flyer and bid I think I got it for 850$ . Awhile back I had a windfall and I was thinking about bidding on an original Henry. I saw an auction in Montana that had one and a bunch of other very high priced rifles BUT I chickened out at 23,000 $ and then did something really dumb. I decided to take that money and invest it, so I bought BITCOIN of all the crap brain ideas ..and lost about half of that money maybe a little more. Now I am not a rich man ,at all, but I sure wish I had won that Civil War Henry and kept it as an investment ..... so I have had a itch for a nice levergun ever since.

Mistered · Post by **Mistered** » Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:52 pm

Found this on one bought in 2013:
https://forums.gunboards.com/showthread ... not-Uberti

Discus420 · Post by **Discus420** » Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:45 pm

Mistered wrote:
What would you say the value of this rifle is ??
That is a tough one as it is unique in the fact that while a 'replica' it has an interesting 'historical' provenance attached to it being it is an original 'Navy' arms rifle.
Fortunately it's not a 'one of a kind' as there were 3000 +/- made as multiples of something typically help value but not having found one sold has an impact on it also - I.E. nothing to compare it to.
I would seriously contact Navy arms and ask them about it - maybe even talk to Val Forgett III - the son of Senior. This is an unusual find.

How would I contact Val Forgett III ???

Mistered · Post by **Mistered** » Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:52 pm

Start by calling, or emailing and request your message goes to him.
http://www.navyarms.com/
You might try going through their Facebook page also.
https://www.facebook.com/NavyArmsFirearms/

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