A simple six shot 38

[BrokenolMarine]

Well, Sorta.

This is a PPC Custom Revolver. I have talked about shooting PPC competition on various locations on the forum, and thought you'd like to see the guns we used to shoot 38 wadcutters from 3 yards (rapid fire standing) all the way back to 50 yards, prone, sitting, kneeling and standing, left and right handed on the barricade.



Most guns had four presets on the sights so you can preset for 7, 15, 25, and 50 yards. That heavy barrel keeps the recoil down in rapid fire and keeps the gun steady at long ranges. Master Class Winning shooters put nearly everything in the 10 ring and most in the x-ring thoughout the entire course.



The target behind me is the one we used for all competitions. In this picture I was about to start a service auto match. This match as well as the service revolver, only shot back to 25 yards. You can clearly see the scoring rings on the B27 target... The small center circle is the x ring and the next out is the 10 ring and so forth.

Imagine shooting at the x-ring from 50 yards, and putting MOST of your shots in that ring. I was NOT a Master Class Shooter... painful knees, back injury, and vision issues. MY Rabbi, was evil. He and his training partner were / are distinguished in all NRA disciplines. Amazing shooters.

I did win in my class and did shoot Five Straight over the course to achieve my Distinguished Police Marksman Award. Not an easy task. The next Officer to achieve the award took seven passes over the course. He never lived it down.

[PT7]

A quite interesting .38 revolver. Can you tell us some of its specs? Metal, weight, barrel length, 5-shot or 6-shot?
With that much revolver moving out a .38 bullet, recoil must be minimal.
Sounds like some interesting competition, too.

[BrokenolMarine]

PT7,

The revolver is a six shot, and has a six inch barrel. I can't tell you what it weighs, but I can tell you it's heavy. That is a heavy steel barrel not cut from aluminum or some other alloy. The revolver is shot double action only, even at 50 yards, and you learn to stage the trigger as you shoot, pulling thru the double action pull to just before letoff, and tightening your sight picture to just where you want it and then ... boom. Roll the trigger thru again and .... boom. Repeat as needed.

Beginning PPC shooters are amazed to discover that after practice sessions their arms and chest ache the next day and they really need to work to build up the muscles. The 38 wadcuttter loads we shot in PPC weren't HOT, but they certainly weren't minimums, as they had to be accurate at 50 yards. That said, the bull barrel kept recoil to bare minimums. The 3 yard line 1st stage was 12 rounds in 20 seconds, with ONE hand. New shooters had a problem for a couple reasons. One hand. One hand with that heavy gun? Rapid fire, they would rush and NOT aim. The speed load to make the 20 second time limit. Not enough practice on the speed load. PPC classified shooters could speedload a revolver as fast as most folks could reload an auto.

Those of us shooting for any length of time shot a ragged one hole group centered in the middle of the x-ring at the 3 yard stage. The rest of the match was a mix of rapid and timed fire over the 7, 15, 25, and 50 yard lines.

It has been a long while since I have shot the PPC course, as I quit shooting the competitions when it was no longer fun for me. I shot to keep my skills up, and to make sure that I could perform under pressure. You would be amazed at how well match pressure can help you succeed under real world pressure.

After I shot for five or six years or so at state level, we got an influx of young cocky new officers, and they were arrogant and only worried about winning and their scores. They social aspect of matches meant nothing to them. They challenged every target and argued for every point. I was done at the end of that season. Had nothing to prove... I had enjoyed shooting the matches, the joking as we scored targets and the camaraderie as we waited to shoot the various stages or waited to be called to the line for various matches to begin. The new shooters put a damper on a lot of that as the older shooters didn't appreciate the new attitude and ... many retired from competition as I did.

The various rules and regs are outlined in the NRA Guidebook for PPC...
https://lecompetitions.nra.org/media/4725/rulebook.pdf

The match courses of fire start on page 7-1

I still shoot on my home range and will still pull the PPC gun out now and then just to see if I can hit anything.

Funny, I can still shoot a bit.

[PT7]

Again, very cool .38 special revolver. Thanks for the stats, and the "how2shoot" info for this competition.

I didn't shoot competition with my Ruger 4-1/4" .357 Magnum/.38 Special revolver. But I always shoot only D/A, never S/A, and it took me a long time to master the sequence of drawing back the D/A trigger (staging it). Your description brought back memories of many range days working on that. I have shot one-handed D/A with this stainless steel Ruger. It was a challenge with its unloaded weight at 29 oz., and I can only imagine the weight of your PPC based on that barrel thickness seen in your photo.

Also appreciated the challenges of this competition. I think tough stuff improves competition. My son-in-law gave me some training in 3-gun competition a few years ago, and being in my upper 60s then, especially the course objectives with a 12-ga shotgun had me really pushing myself. It was fun to do, but not easy. I'm not sure if I can continue to do that course he has on his range since I'll hit the seven-decade mark this year....but sure would like to try it again.

The difference in shooters you mentioned is exemplified at two MDC ranges I frequent here in MO. One has an abundance of shooters using AR rifle in large calibers (= noise+ for my ears!), with a lot of focus on getting those POIs in the bull. The second range is what I've enjoyed --- some good 'ole MO farmers keeping their shooting skills sharp, but also most willing to help newbies out. I'm a newbie since only been shooting for about 4 years now, so have had good help and fun getting to know these fellows, shooting with them, and learning something new each range visit. So yes, as the years pass by, many things easily can become different as new ways may come into vogue. One thing is very certain --- the only constant is change.

Thanks for the interesting thread.

[RanchRoper]

Holy cow that is some barrel!

[ditto1958]

Holy cow that is some barrel!

I don't think that's a bull barrel. Looks like a mastodon barrel to me!

[BrokenolMarine]

One incident really stuck in my mind from that last year of competition.

We were about to start the service auto match, and were lining up on the seven yard line. I looked over and noticed two young officers new to our group. "Good Morning," I said, "First time shooting with us?"

They looked over, and I knew what they saw. Just under six foot, just over forty, and just over two twenty. My tactical boots and pants were broken in, my duty gear was well used, and my Sig P220 had sent thousands of rounds down range. Old...

"First time here," the shooter closest to me said.
"Certainly not our first time." Said his buddy.

If asked to note their tone for a report, "Snotty," would have been what I would have written.

The match director announced a delay to repair a target, stand easy on the line. I looked at the ground to rest my eyes and shook my arms to relax my shoulders. I had already shot several classes for the day. As we wait, I overhear the two next to me talking.

"If we are going to shoot this match every month, we need to find a good 45 load for the SIG so we don't have to buy ammo."

I glance at their holsters, and they are carrying the P220, just like the old guy next to them. I say. "If you are interested, I shoot a star..."

"No one asked you..." snaps one of the bobsey twins.

ON THE LINE... says the match director to get our attention.
He begins the run down and we start the match, after stage one... the shooter next to me scores my target.
When I see he is having trouble, I offer a suggestion...
"The rule of thumb is, if there is just one ragged hole in the center like that, and no other hits anywhere on the target son, we usuallly score the stage as all Xs, or call the line judge and let them do it."

He wasn't so arrogant after stage one. A lot less arrogant when I won. I won that match now and then when the master class guys didn't get bored and shoot it for fun.

When the match ended a polite pair of young officers came up and asked if I minded sharing the load data for the Sig. I not only wrote it down, I gave them each a dozen loaded rounds to test prior to loading ammo using my data, to make sure it shot well in their Sigs too. (It did.)

Maybe they learned something... maybe not. I heard another shooter tell them I was a department instructor... duh. "Old... he told them, doesn't mean incapable. Most of the master class shooters here have gray hair."

[RetiredSeabee]

I would have to hit the weight room six days a week just to lift that barrel.

[daytime dave]

I remember those barrels and such in my day. I always liked stock revolvers, but guys who had those could zero in on anything.
You are a good man and let those snotty guys off without so much as a warning.
Good for you. I strive for the one ragged hole. Often, I think I was shooting buckshot, lol.

[BrokenolMarine]

Dave,

I tried to remember my first couple local matches and how nice folks were to me. It kept me coming back. This one young law student came up to me after my third or forth match and said he had asked "Lou" to put him beside me on all the matches. "You are coming along fine, but you are rushing. When we shoot the matches today, if you are reloading or changing positions before me, slow down."

At first, I thought, how arrogant, but I figured that the match director, Lou... wouldn't have put him there if he didn't think it was a good idea. This was confirmed when I caught his eye in the tower. He pointed at the lawyer to be, then his hearing protectors. LISTEN.

We not only became good friends, but the team to beat shooting together at the local level matches. He helped me improve much faster than I would have, and I always tried to pay it forward. Shooters would loan ammo and equipment back then.

[daytime dave]

It sounds like Lou knew what he was doing in pairing you up.

[BrokenolMarine]

It's funny, people come and go in our lives. They drift in and out and pass thru like traffic. Some we feel a pang when we suddenly realize it's been a year since we've seen them, others we want to throw a party. come on, we've all come across those folks... they make successful comedies about them... don t look at me like that.

Every now and then, you are lucky enough to get one that sticks with you. A real friend that becomes like family. You can call at 2am and they will answer the phone, and you'd take their calls. When you ask for advice, they tell you what they really think, not what you want to hear, even knowing it will make you .

Lou was my mentor in the shooting sports, and the first thing I learned was how much I didn't know... then the teaching began.
He was my Rabbi, my advisor, my counselor in my law enforcement career. He was never in my chain of command, but guided me anyway.

He became my friend somewhere along the way. Laughing when I moved way out in the small county an hour's drive from everything. When he retired he bought twenty five acres on a pond and built a house and pistol range... ten minutes from me. Still there for advice, we can have coffee in the kitchens a couple times a month. He still tries to look out for "the kid," and I'm nearly 59 and retired. He will turn 80 this year, has retired, but still competes and wins.

Grumpy old man... folks love him or hate him, no halfway. But they all respect him.