Henry Rifle Forums

I wanted to include this in the last post regarding thumb clearance in between the hammer and the eyepiece on my scope, but this is best suited as a different post.

Rifle: Henry H001M
Scope: Diamondback Vortex, 4-12X40
Scope Mounts: 3/8ths dovetail Weaver style rings: https://s14.postimg.cc/5muz62z41/Scope_Mounts.jpg
Ammo: CCI 22 WMR, Troy Landry Edition, 40 grain, Maxi-Mag
Caldwell Rock Junior, with rear bag

My zero is changing when I'm at the range. In short, I had it re-bore sighted after having removed the scope mounts from the dovetail when I cleaned the rifle over Christmas. Zero was lost, and the range guy put it back to where it was supposed to be.

With a clean bore a front rest, and rear bag, I re-zeroed the rifle first at 50 yards, and was pretty happy, but noticed that the POA, vs the POI was changing, by and inch here, and inch there, high and to the right. I felt like I had to keep bringing the turrets back over and down a few clicks, to keep it on target of my POA.

Fast forward to last weekend, I re-zeroed the rifle at 100 yards, with splatter targets, the first few shots were a bit off, I dialed it over and down, and after about 6 shots, got the POI within a 1/4" of my POA - very happy to see a hole in a 1" box, knowing that the POI is only off by a 1/4" to 1/2 inch.

For the next 40 shots, I got fairly good groups, 1"-1.5", some tighter, and hitting 5-6, (1" to 1.5" wide) heirloom potatoes on the target board in succession, dead on at 100 yards, — IF I held the crosshairs just slightly left and below the potato. SEE: https://s14.postimg.cc/u0t9dx6jl/Potato_Targets_1.jpg These are bigger 2-3" potatoes from last fall, but this was the aim point ( GREEN +) I used from last weekend as reference.

So, I thought I'd adjust the turrets just slightly, to hold dead center on the potato instead of left and lower. Then I adjusted 2 clicks to the right and maybe 2 up, and it was off again???

Then I started missing, high, maybe right? Both? I could see dirt splashes behind the target board, but not on paper, and not being able to understand why it would change like that so quickly.

Here's the point, — it never stays where I want it to over time in one sitting at the range. I would expect the POI to be somewhat off, — ammo, ME etc, but not 2" high all of a sudden, or favoring the right by 2". Sometimes the POI is so off that I can't see where it went, when trying to put it near the last shot. It's like the group changes arbitrarily.

QUESTION: Should I change the type of scope to something like a Leupold, or the mount to rail system with 4 bolts instead of 2?

Basically, how do I eliminate certain things, to figure out what IS happening, as it's happening?

I'm having a hard time understanding why it's bang on for a while, then off again.

Well if it's happening at 100 yds, it's not a parallax problem.

Not that I'm doubting the Landry ammo ( I prefer it myself), but have you tried different ammo?

Those rings do look a little on the light side, but they should be doing the trick. Try a different scope?

are all of your scope mount screws tight

Yes, the range guy (who isn't a gunsmith) but installs many scopes, knows guns re-boresighted my rifle, and made sure everything was tight, and bang on.

A friend said he'd loan me a gun sled. It's plastic with good grip areas at the stock and fore-end. I just need the rifle clamped into position, to see how it behaves over time - after 50 rounds, 60 rounds, over a few hours.

I'll move the sled with the gun in it to find a different POA on the target paper, potatoes etc, to see if it holds its zero. I just don't understand why it's so bang on for awhile, and then not. Frustrating.

Regarding scope mounts, would a drilled and tapped holes in the top of the dovetail (old school) be "better", or should I just swap out the rings for ones like these? : https://media.mwstatic.com/productimage ... 348187.jpg

if your scope is working as it should and if it is mounted properly, it would seem logical to me that installing another scope has a low probability of being the problem


is there any relationship between how hot the barrel is and when the accuracy goes away

CT, that's one of those miserable headaches we can get with a particular gun, now and then. You begin the process of elimination and hope for the best. Sometimes you figure out the culprit, right away, and sometimes you never really do. Those are the ones that get traded off. I feel your pain.

First thing is to go back to 50 yards and work on the problem. That extra 50 yards out to 100 adds way more variables than you need. It will only confuse and complicate the process. Remember, too, that it is ALWAYS a challenge for any rimfire to maintain the same MOA at 50 yards when shooting at 100.

Let's begin with the easy things.

DO try different ammo. The 22 mag is notorious for being ammo fussy. With some loads, I have gotten unexpected flyers. Could easily be the ammo.

DO check your technique for consistency on where and how you rest the gun, work the trigger and so on. On lever guns or any guns with two piece stocks, you need to be very careful about resting the gun on the forearm. On these guns, I much prefer to rest the gun under the receiver for better consistency or placing my hand between the bag and the forearm when resting on the forearm.

DO check that forearm band for excessive tightness. In some cases, I've loosened it and slipped it forward off the wood to see if it was the problem. Forearm bands should always be on your list of possible culprits.

DO consider the weather and lighting conditions before drawing any conclusions about the gun. Rimfires are always sensitive to weather and shooting conditions. Do your testing on calm days if at all possible.

DO check the crown on the barrel. If there are any imperfections or obviously damaged spots, you've likely found your culprit. Check the residue patterns after shooting. You should get a nice concentric star pattern. If you are getting a residue pattern that is not the same all the way around the crown, not good.

Then, if none of the above are having any effect, it is time to consider scope and mount issues. Let's face it, rimfire dovetail mounting systems are, uh, crude (to keep things polite). Those Weaver are really low end. It wouldn't hurt to try better rings, but if they're tight, I'd go on to the scope.

With the scope, ALWAYs tap that turret immediately after making adjustments. Even on a high end scope, the adjustments won't always click into place until after a few shots. Then when the adjustment does click into place, your POI suddenly changes. This is not uncommon on new scopes, by the way.

When all else is exhausted, you have to consider you got a bum barrel. It can happen, but it's usually the last thing on my list to explore.

Best of luck and DO let us know how things proceed.

JEBar, yes, all of the screw mounts are tight. He made sure of that. About the barrel heating up. I don't really know enough about this, other than people have told me, "when the barrel heats up, it can change how a projectile behaves downrange". I usually load the Henry 1 round at a time via the ejection port. I'm often too lazy to stand up, put the rifle on it's stock and load the tube, I also find I shoot less bullets loading them 1 at a time.

I did zero the rifle initially a few weeks ago at 50 yards, with a superbly clean barrel, and got it within a 1/4 inch of where I wanted it. I discovered that if I made very small adjustments to the turrets, ex: 1 click left, 1 click down instead of 2 clicks each way, I'd get closer to my POI, vs 2 clicks each way.

At 50 yards, the bullet would often be slightly high and right of my POA. If I was aiming at the center of the 1" square on the target paper, it usually resulted in striking the top right corner inside that 1" box, or just below. I'd adjust by making 1 click left, 1 down, and then I'd be an 8th of an inch from center — more than good enough.

Then out of the blue, the POI was the same, but the bullet would hit higher right, sometimes an inch off the POA. Then I'd reel it back in by making another adjustment as I did before, 1 click down, 1 click left, that kind of thing. It's like it won't stay where I want it to.

When I re-zeroed it at 100 yards last Saturday, I was astounded that I was able to hit these even smaller potatoes - that I had only hit in succession with the CZ. The Henry nailed all 5 potatoes in a row, one after the other, again, if I held lower and left on the potato. THEN, when I went back to paper, they'd go high, and I wasn't always able to see where they'd go, but they sure weren't hitting the potatoes anymore. Just generally.. inconsistent over a few hours.

I think I'm going to do what NCG suggested, at 50 yards, over an hour or more, to see what happens. At least I can see those holes in splatter targets more easily at 50 yards.

About the barrel band. I noticed months ago that it was loose. I asked my range guy who re-boresighted my scope about it. He said it's best to just tighten everything up, and zero from there. But I've read that a tight or loose barrel band can and does change the harmonics of the barrel. But as tight as it was last week, didn't change the accuracy when I hit those potatoes. So???

I think the crown is fine, I've never put anything down that barrel other than a boresnake. I've also done the q-tip swab test at the mouth of the crown, and no fuzzies showed up. And why would the rifle be dead accurate at one sitting, and not the next, or change within an hour.

How long does a field grade barrel on a Henry rimfire need to "cool down"? I don't really fire fast, I tend to have at least 10-15 seconds in between ejecting a spent casing, and loading another single, sometimes waiting even minutes, so I can see where I missed.

I'm going to try a different rest this weekend, a friend is loaning me his MT sled. I'll try and dial things in at 50 yards again. And we'll see what happens over the next hour or 2.

The ammo is always the Landry stuff, because it's cheaper per round in the 200 round boxes. And I have about 850 rounds left from 1000! So, I'll have to use them. I've also shot the Winchester Super X, lead round nose, JHP, and they seemed to do well in my rifle, but it was only a box of 50.

What I'd love to get, is a softer, leather rear rest, under-filled with shot, and with a narrower V at the front and rear. Front bag with non-leather under-filled, so the fore-end just sinks into it and stays put. SEE: http://protektormodel.com/images/1C.jpg The henry is a slender rifle, and it cants too much from the rear bag, the hard filled leather of the caldwell junior I have is too hard, and stiff for the forend to sink, so I'm always pressing it down into it, to create an impression — with an Allen rear bag that's just too dense, and now narrow enough.

Guys, would changing my scope mounts to one of those 4 bolt integrated rail systems be "better"? Sorry for the babble text, there's so much to tell. A face to face at the range and you guys actually shooting my gun over 20 minutes would be much quicker.

I went to the range yesterday for 2 hours with the H001M, and had every intention of shooting it. But, there was a used Marlin XT-22 in 22 mag, stainless steel bull barrel, micro grooved, wood stock, on consignment for $450 CDN, fitted with a Simmons Predator Quest 4.5-18x44. I had seen the rifle weeks before, and asked the range manager at the front desk if he could call the owner, to ask him if I could sight it in and put a few rounds through it at 100 yards. He said no problem. So I took the Marlin to the bench and proceeded to put 50 rounds through it over the next few hours, never even getting the Henry out of the rifle case.

I shot the CCI - Troy Landry Edition 40 grain maxi-mag from the 200 round box, the stuff I always shoot.

First impressions, the magazine was a little funky. Steel construction, super durable, but it was awkward to get it into the magazine well. The first few shots from the bench were off a bit off, high and right, but not by much. I brought the elevation and windage turrets to the aim-point, getting it as close as possible, maybe 4 clicks left, and 4-6 down.

The next 5-8 shots were astoundingly accurate. I should have taken pictures but I didn't. I placed a shot directly over the number 8 on this Birchwood Casey Silhouette Splattering Target: https://www.birchwoodcasey.com/CMSPages ... 92292a61b5 The target was left behind by someone before I got to that target board. Then on the number 7, within a few mm of the number itself, and then a few more rounds into the UPC bar code box etc.

Potatoes were next, I drilled 4 pilot holes into the top edge of the board as usual, stuck toothpicks into the holes, and spiked 1" small potatoes onto them. I shot 3 in a row, dead on. But.. after the 4th or 5th shot, those familiar dirt splashes behind the target board started happening, with no obvious holes in the target paper. It was shooting high and to the right — EXACTLY like my Henry.

It continued to shoot this way, to the point where I couldn't see on paper how far off my aim point it was - just like my Henry. For some reason, when it was off the aim point (like the Henry) it was way off, and not just by a few inches, or else I would have seen the hole in the splatter target.

AMMO? I have no idea. I assumed the rifle would be more accurate being a bolt, bull barrel etc, but was I ever wrong. It behaved almost identically to my Henry after X number of rounds.

I'm going back to the range later to clean the bore of the Marlin, and try to re-zero that thing on large grid paper, bring a ruler etc. I just think it's god awful that a rifle can be that ON, and then that off - suddenly.

I need a gun sled, that locks the gun into place, and a clean bore to see where the POI changes, after X number of rounds, how far off, and if cool down is needed.

This is really odd to me (a new shooter), because that CZ 455 shooting CCI A17, .17 HMR, was never off by more than a few mm - and that I attributed to me or wind. Still learning...

Tube feed guns will usually string vertically when the barrel gets hot. It's due to the barrel being attached to the tube and the barrel grows with heat whilst the tube is still cool and does not move.

Sight your gun in to be accurate when cool as that's the logical condition your gun will be in when hunting.