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Re: Razor Sharp
Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 7:27 am
by GunnyGene
markiver54 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 16, 2020 6:54 pm
Very nice Gunny. Will keep that in mind. Great info, however the kitchen is not very large and she's a real stickler about storage. Beautiful boards though!
Wood boards should be stored on edge anyway, not left flat on a countertop, to equalize moisture and prevent warping, etc. I made a simple rack for us for that reason, but you can use most anything to support them on edge to save counter space also.
Re: Razor Sharp
Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 9:10 am
by JEBar
GunnyGene wrote: ↑Fri Jul 17, 2020 7:27 am
Wood boards should be stored on edge anyway, not left flat on a countertop, to equalize moisture and prevent warping, etc. I made a simple rack for us for that reason, but you can use most anything to support them on edge to save counter space also.
I didn't know that ..
.. info appreciated .... as it turned out, my wife already knew ..
Re: Razor Sharp
Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 9:36 am
by markiver54
Links are appreciated Dave!
Re: Razor Sharp
Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 9:42 am
by markiver54
GunnyGene wrote: ↑Fri Jul 17, 2020 6:47 am
The reason knives (and other edged tools) dull is partly due to the granular structure of the alloy, and partly due to the edge that results from sharpening. Any abrasive used to remove metal will result in a microscopic irregular sawtooth pattern on the cutting edge. The finer the abrasive, the finer the "teeth" on the edge. The first few times you use the blade these very tiny and thin points will break off leaving what we perceive as a dull edge. Our objective in sharpening (to obtain a sharper and longer lasting edge) is to remove the "sawtooth" to the limits of the granular structure of the steel. This is where stropping comes into play, by controlled breaking and thinning these microscopic teeth to get as close to a continuous "toothless" edge as possible given the limits of the steel itself. Of course the shallower the angle is the thinner and weaker the edge will be, and that means it will bend more easily and eventually break off. So we must compromise between durability of the edge and it's sharpness by adjusting the sharpening angle(s). Again, the quality of the steel (hardness, alloy, etc.) limits what we can expect in both durability of the edge and it's potential degree of "sharpness" we can obtain.
Never knew any of that. A lot more scientific than I thought!!
Thanks Gunny, that sure gives me a better perspective of sharpening.
Re: Razor Sharp
Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 10:20 am
by JEBar
the angle on a Buck Knife is ground to 13-16 degrees per side .... that spread shows that even Buck can't sharpen to an exact angle .... if you hold the knife against the stone to cut evenly across the edge grind, you will produce an edge with a similar angle .... if you hold the blade at too high of an angle, the resulting edge will lose some slicing ability but will stand up better to chopping ... in short, over time you will develop an angle that works for you
Re: Razor Sharp
Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 10:41 am
by GunnyGene
markiver54 wrote: ↑Fri Jul 17, 2020 9:42 am
GunnyGene wrote: ↑Fri Jul 17, 2020 6:47 am
The reason knives (and other edged tools) dull is partly due to the granular structure of the alloy, and partly due to the edge that results from sharpening. Any abrasive used to remove metal will result in a microscopic irregular sawtooth pattern on the cutting edge. The finer the abrasive, the finer the "teeth" on the edge. The first few times you use the blade these very tiny and thin points will break off leaving what we perceive as a dull edge. Our objective in sharpening (to obtain a sharper and longer lasting edge) is to remove the "sawtooth" to the limits of the granular structure of the steel. This is where stropping comes into play, by controlled breaking and thinning these microscopic teeth to get as close to a continuous "toothless" edge as possible given the limits of the steel itself. Of course the shallower the angle is the thinner and weaker the edge will be, and that means it will bend more easily and eventually break off. So we must compromise between durability of the edge and it's sharpness by adjusting the sharpening angle(s). Again, the quality of the steel (hardness, alloy, etc.) limits what we can expect in both durability of the edge and it's potential degree of "sharpness" we can obtain.
Never knew any of that. A lot more scientific than I thought!!
Thanks Gunny, that sure gives me a better perspective of sharpening.
This problem with steel (and other metals) has been known for a long time. There are a couple ways of improving steel blades in particular. One of those is to use laminated blades of different alloys. The ancient Japanese perfected this with so called "samurai" blades (Katana, etc.), which had a much harder alloy sandwiched between layers of a softer alloy. The hard cutting edge was brittle and the outer layers being more malleable added strength to the inner hard but brittle center. Kitchen knifes made in this manner can still be bought, but are usually quite expensive.
Here's a little bed time reading about the various steel alloys used for knives in general:
https://www.knivesandtools.com/en/ct/st ... knives.htm
https://www.bladehq.com/cat--Best-Knife ... uide--3368
Re: Razor Sharp
Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 2:21 pm
by Rifletom
Dang, this is some very good info for sharpening my knives. And here I thought I was a sharpening guru with my DMT diamond sharpener gizmo! Certainly learned something new. Hot dog!
Re: Razor Sharp
Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 2:52 pm
by RanchRoper
Good info.
Re: Razor Sharp
Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 5:02 pm
by GunnyGene
Rifletom wrote: ↑Fri Jul 17, 2020 2:21 pm
Dang, this is some very good info for sharpening my knives. And here I thought I was a sharpening guru with my DMT diamond sharpener gizmo! Certainly learned something new. Hot dog!
Glad I could help. After what seems like years of sharpening various woodworking hand tools you learn what works and what doesn't. Shoving a #7C handplane thru a couple miles of hardwood teaches you what sharp really is (or isn't).
Re: Razor Sharp
Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 5:13 pm
by Rifletom
GG, I have two old Stanley's: a #5 and a # 203. They belonged to my Grandfather and are still in excellent shape. And damn sharp! I used the smaller one(203) on my work bench. Worked great.