Henry Rifle Forums

Hey guys,

Been having an accuracy problem with basically both my airguns lately and it's kind of been driving me crazy. Airguns have always been kind of a black magic to me, and so I figured the cause of the problem was most likely myself. Usually shoot Crosman Premier HPs

Anyway, haven't shot this one in a few weeks, mostly cause it's been so erratic, but thought I'd give it a shot, and it was about half charged far as I knew.

So shooting at some beer cans (I'm drinking coffee ) and yeah, first shot right on, second shot high right, third shot a little left, and so on. I'm thinking the barrel's leaded. Take a look, doesn't look bad. Figured I'd run out the CO2 and switched to Diablo Basics just to see, and suddenly I'm hitting right on every time. Better yet, as the CO2 Drained the shots got lower but stayed right on the Y-axis. None of this walking all over the place

Tonight I took the barrel off and cleaned it and setup a target a little over 25yd lit with a flashlight and took a few shots from a rest > first one way low 6 oclock >1st shot pierces second canister > second shot a little higher and so on until after about 12 shots they were all going through the same hole.

And this was after taking the scope off and putting it back on with no adjustments. It also shot the 7g Daisy wadcutters well.

The only thing I can think of that changed are the Crosman Pellets. You can also feel how the Crosmans are inconsistent when you put them in the breech, while the German pellets are the same; but that has always been true, but they were still accurate.

Anybody else experiencing any problems with the Crosman Premiums?

Maybe I just got two bad tins (500), or maybe I should stop buying them at Walmart?

It happens from time to time. I know a lot of guys that weigh and sort their pellets. I don't think the metal tin Crosman pellets are anywhere near the consistency of the ones in the cardboard box. That said, I shoot mostly JSB pellets now. The skirts are softer and even the ones that are slightly deformed blow out and engage the rifling when you shoot them.

Great to see you shooting airguns. You nailed it with narrowing it down to the difference in pellets. I've found that air guns are as picky, or even more picky, than rimfires as to what you feed them. Even two airguns of the exact same model can prefer different pellets.

My experience with Crosman pellets is similar to yours and that of a lot of air gunners. As with any pellet model, some of my guns like them and some don't. When I do shoot Crosmans, though, I avoid the ones in the tin and go only with the brown box variety. A lot of us find that the bulk brown box versions of the same exact pellet have better consistency than the ones sold in tins. Why, I can't say. Just the way it is. Consistency wise, the ones sold in tins can be a crap shoot. I don't buy those, anymore.

Also, in my experimenting with pellet designs, I've found that the only design that gives me the accuracy I want past 30 or 35 yards is a domed pellet and, of course, they are superbly accurate at any distance. HPs, pointed pellets and other hunting designs so on do fine out to that 30 or 35 yard mark, but the domed pellet is king at 50 yards. Have yet to find any exception, regardless of brand.

By the way, for anyone new to air guns, those high grade, very expensive match wadcutter pellets are designed specifically, for 10 meter shooting for the sake of cutting clean holes and scoring. Once past 10 meters, the wadcutter design starts to lose accuracy, fast. I can get decent accuracy with wad cutters out to about 25 yards, but past that, other designs give me much better accuracy.

Hope this helps.

Hey Guys, Thanks for the replies.........

I have read that same thing about the boxed CPHPs and the tins, it seems in countless places, Yellow forum included. I had to conclude it was an internet urban legend, but now you two guys are saying it..... makes me think I'm going to give it a try.....the thing is they're not really cheaper even in bulk, so that may be an indication of something.

But yes NCG I did know about the limitations of the wadcutter and knew I was at maximum range close to 30yds, but they were all I had. The $2 for 250 Daisy 7g wadcutters seem to do very well too. There are 2 or 3 shots on the target (above) with those.

I started to wonder if maybe this gun just likes the lighter pellets?

BTW I have plenty of the RWS superdomes but they don't fit into the breech of this QB78 well, too tight (can tell even through the bolt).

So that's it. I have a lot of computer knowledge about this, but lack some practical experience, and have shot maybe 5K CPHPs, but the last two tins have caused me a lot of aggravation.

Thanks again guys...........

You're very welcome. These little challenges as to what a gun likes or does not likes one of the things I enjoy about air guns.

I keep thinking about adding a pellet gun to the mix. I think back to when the kids were all still home and in school. We'd sit up on the raised back deck at our old house, ten feet up, and shoot at ice cubes tossed into the grass below. A great way to move into sunset, and NO mess from targets to clean up later. We had a couple entry level guns bought at walmart... but the kids enjoyed them.

BrokenolMarine wrote:I keep thinking about adding a pellet gun to the mix. I think back to when the kids were all still home and in school. We'd sit up on the raised back deck at our old house, ten feet up, and shoot at ice cubes tossed into the grass below. A great way to move into sunset, and NO mess from targets to clean up later. We had a couple entry level guns bought at walmart... but the kids enjoyed them.

I don't give many guarantees, but in this case I feel pretty confident BoM you will not regret it. There really is no difference, certainly accuracy wise, between a .22lr and a good pellet gun; other than the loading process which if precharged is nothing more than operating a bolt or whatever means of loading the pellet.

The QB78 of this thread I got from pyramid air delivered for $120 (no tax). I stuck a 20 year old asian scope on it, and there you are

I can shoot an honest 50 shots with 2 12oz CO2 cartridges. All I do is cycle the bolt and put in the pellet. It is strange when I pull back the bolt and nothing ejects

Myself, I wouldn't buy it at Walmart but get something decent. Walmart does offer pretty much anything online; then have it shipped to the store where you can inspect it before signing. North Country Girl will probably chip in with her experience here shortly.

The most important thing to decide is what kind of gun to get, there are so many...........

Good Luck

Thanks. My problem has been not knowing WHAT to buy. I don't want to spend a fortune as we are cutting back on spending these days. But, like you said, I don't want to buy a cheapo inaccurate walmart special either. I may start looking around this spring. The VA had an air rifle program and sent three shooters out west a couple years ago to shoot in a wheelchair event. One of our friends did pretty well for his first time competing at that level. The gun, hard case, shooting jacket, and spotting scope he used out west cost more than his car. He has a nice car.

Yeah BoM, like anything, the salesman's first question is, "So BrokenolMarine, how much were you thinking of spending?"

But the way I see it, at least as far as rifles, the choices are:

1) Springer > One pump between 20 and 30 lbs of force. Very consistent and powerful but takes a lot of practice to master, otherwise accuracy can suffer. Also heavy and requires rated scope.

2)Multipump > Pain to pump but no recoil or special artillery hold to worry about.

3) Precharged > usually the favorite of the pros but $$$$$ and can be a nusance to recharge. The QB78 of this thread is a poor man's version of this, and can be modified to be a regular precharged (QB79) as well as add a 10 round rotary mag so all you have to do is work the bolt

https://www.airgundepot.com/beeman-qb78-air-rifle.html

https://www.airgundepot.com/beeman-qb79-air-rifle.html

This thing has a cult following BTW, and is kind of the 1022 of chinese airguns.

https://www.airgundepot.com/beeman-ar2079a.html

http://www.archerairguns.com/chinese-airguns-s/1.htm
And 4? Can't really think of a 4th?

So there you are as I see it......

Can you recharge the cannister using the shop compressor?
How much will I spend?
Depends on what I can get for each step when I do my shopping.
Certainly not four figures.
I might go higher if I can get nice accuracy and low maintenance with squirrel power. Tina would put that to good use around here.
Quiet early in the morning.

Hey BoM, North Country Girl is the expert. Daytime also has these. You can use whatever you want, but need hi pressure, litterally 1000's of psi.

I believe NCG uses a Scuba Tank LOL.

Yeah, mention air guns and just try to shut me up!

No, you cannot use a shop compressor to fill a PCP, at least not by itself. They won't get you the necessary 2000 to 3000 plus psi to do a fill. There is something called shoebox compressor, which runs in conjunction with a ship compressor that boosts the psi, but now we're talking more money than a lot of rifles cost just for the shoebox compressor. Most of us who shoot PCP either use special hand pumps (get in shape for this option) or scuba tanks, which you get refilled at a local dive shop and so on.

The guys pretty much nailed it on the options, so I'l just add a few notes, mostly on what NOT to buy. Avoid those cheap Wal-mart "magnum" gas piston or spring piston guns that advertise 1100 fps and avoid them like the plague. That also goes for the ones with big name company labels like Ruger. These have nothing to do with Ruger or other big names. They just pay to use the name. The higher the power on a piston gun, the greater the recoil and the greater challenge to shoot with accuracy. That, coupled with cheap construction and especially, lousy triggers (triggers are very important on an air gun for accurate shooting) almost guarantees a lousy and disappointing experience with cheap springers.

My favorite air gun type is the springer followed closely by the pump ups. These are the ones I typically post about. Springers are the most convenient to shoot, by far, but there's a learning curve on the technique needed to shoot them with accuracy. Won't happen, overnight. Once learned, though, you'll never regret taking the time to get there. If you shop around, you can find a Weihrauch (HW) 30s, 50S or 95S for that $300 figure and have a super gun that will last for the rest of your life. The little sweet shooting HW30S is easily my most used air rifle.

Classic American pump up guns are a very affordable option. The beauty of these is that you can use as many or as few pumps to get the velocity you want. I use 4 pumps on all my pump ups for target work (4 or 5 pumps is the sweet spot for velocity consistency). Benjamin (owned by Crosman) still makes a rugged and sturdy all metal and wood 397 PA (177, recommended) or 392 PA (22) for under $200.

And then there's the Crosman pump ups. Here's where you can actually buy a very serviceable air gun at Wal-mart. The Classic 2100 is a very affordable shooter. Cheap plastic construction, to be sure, but it will shoot. Same for the even cheaper 760. The 1377 or 1322 pump up pistols are also decent shooters and you can get an add-on stock to make them rifles.

Thanks for all the info, I may copy and paste this to a word doc for future reference so if I do make a purchase in the summer, I can have it handy.

If you go the pcp route, a hand pump is definitely the cheapest option. I paid around $150 for mine. I'm a pretty big guy, and I don't find it overly difficult, but it helps to have some weight behind those last few strokes. I usually top my gun off and shoot 20 to 30 rounds in a session, so it works perfectly for me. If you're the type that shoots a few hundred rounds at the time, I'm not sure I would recommend a hand pump.

Henry88 wrote:Hey BoM, North Country Girl is the expert. Daytime also has these.

Henry 88 nailed it right there. NCG is the expert here. I just have some.

Marine, everything NCG said is right on the mark. I have no experience with the QB-78 guns. However, I was about to pull the trigger on one when they began to be marketed under the Beeman brand. I was going to follow up and never did. I think that one of those, especially the repeater, would be a nice, easy gun to shoot. The PCP hand pump is an ordeal and I wouldn't suggest it for you or Miss Tina. The 397 and 392 are great guns and I would not hesitate to tell you, pumps 7 and 8 are not like 2 and 3. The multi pumps also work best for me at 4 and 5 pumps. When hunting, they get six pumps.

The simple, basic QB-78 intrigues me. The only criticism I know of is seal issues, but if they are mass marketed by Beeman, I would think you would hear more of it. A simple, drop in power unit, the two CO2 cylinders are easy to find and use. If the accuracy is there, I'd say that might be to your needs. Miss Tina can pop a varmint trying to get a free chicken dinner and you can do some target work, all on the same two cylinders. They also have an adapter for the larger tanks that the paint ballers use that are sold at Walmart.

For what they offer, the QB types were always packed with features.

For strictly 10 meter target work, the Civilian Marksmanship program sells used Daisy Avanti rifles that they refurbish and ship with a new sight, for around 100.oo plus shipping. They are great, one pump rifles. Not much for hunting velocity, but very accurate.

Hey, I just came in here to look around and saw this airgun section.. cool.
I just bought a Crosman 1322 with the add-on buttstock for my backyard. I had one in .177 in the 70s that I couldn't miss with, at close range. We shot hornets off an old log, even. Hit em every time. The kids thought I was Wild Bill Hickok.
I only got the .22 for easier handling pellets and bore cleaning, plus I never had a .22 so there's that. I only plink at close ranges (15-50 feet) and a few pumps so the simple Crosman will do fine. Cheap pellets, too! No need for match grade stuff here. My backyard has a lot of wood borers and I have some pop cans.

Great to hear you are back into it Conax. The 1322 is a fun gun. With the butt stock, you can be just that much more steady. Make a thread and post your airgun adventures in the airgun forum. If you can add photos, even better.

daytime dave wrote:Great to hear you are back into it Conax. The 1322 is a fun gun. With the butt stock, you can be just that much more steady. Make a thread and post your airgun adventures in the airgun forum. If you can add photos, even better.

Couldn't agree more with what Dave is saying. We have a 1377 and for the money, I think it is a best buy in a pump pistol. One thing I really like about it is that it much easier to pump than a Sheridan/Benjamin H series pump pistol. Have one of those, too. The secret is that long pump arm handle on the 1377. It's much longer than on a Benjamin/Sheridan and gives you a lot more leverage. That short arm on the Benjamin is a mean little bugger to pump. Another thing I like about the 1377/22 is its inexpensive modular construction. You can easily replace just about any part.

daytime dave wrote:Great to hear you are back into it Conax. The 1322 is a fun gun. With the butt stock, you can be just that much more steady. Make a thread and post your airgun adventures in the airgun forum. If you can add photos, even better.

Ok, I'll see if I can find a way to make it interesting.
Maybe a video of it knocking bees off a pop can..