Lead VS Jacketed

[JEBar]

OK, I freely admit I'm not up on all the latest info about many (if not most) current trends in shooting .... one I've been following that has me wondering as to the "why" behind it deals with lead and jacketed bullets .... in several different conversations I've read comments that one should only fire either lead or jacked bullets in a barrel but not both .. .. I don't understand that ? .... I've always fired whatever ammo I have in whatever rifle or pistol I was using .... in our Ruger Redhawk 44, we've literally fired thousands (if not 10's of thousand of each) .... at times I've loaded it with 3 of each .... so my question is, what is the rational behind only firing lead or jacketed ..

[CT_Shooter]

...so my question is, what is the rational behind only firing lead or jacketed.

Thanks, JEBar. I've also wondered about that. I have fired lead bullets, but I mostly use jacketed for their increased velocity. But, why would restricting a gun to using one or the other matter?

[tx gunrunner]

This is the short version the jacket bullet leave copper alloy fouling in barrel and lead sticks to this fouling and cause barrel to leaded up barrel very fast and this causes lead bullets to be very inaccurate . Plus it it very hard to remove lead from a leaded up bore . I have 2 barrels for all my Glocks . The stock [ original ] barrel for jacket bullets and I have a Lone Wolf just for lead bullet only . I have guns I shoot only jacket bullets in them and guns that only shoot lead bullet in them . Lead polishes a gun bore the more you shoot them the smooth they get . My 44-40 and Glock below have never had a jacket fire in them and only a wet patch and 2 dry clean the bore pefect .

[Squatch]

Unfortunately I don't have the option of 2 barrels for my rifles. I do try to keep the barrels free of any fouling lead or otherwise.

I've been experimenting with lead bullets with mixed results. I've been getting some leading at speeds way below what I would expect for supposedly "hard Cast" bullets. I don't know for sure the BHN of the ones I've been using. But the slower I go the less leading I'm getting. The ones I have (500 of them) in 44 mag will soon be tried with some light 44 special loads.

I have had some great luck with some of the newer tech stuff. Berry's copper plated have worked out well in the 44 mag. The Missouri Bullet Company coated bullets 18 BHN have worked quite well in my 45/70 at 1,100+ fps. Neither have caused much fouling of any sort. The cost a little more than straight lead but much less than jacketed ammo. I'll be ordering more of each in both 44 mag and 45/70.

These days for mostly target shooting I don't see the need or expense of factory power level jacketed bullets for MY uses.

For the 44 I load for 2 different guns so that complicates stuff a little.

I'm loading mostly light loads so lead should be ideal. I intend to slug my barrels soon. I need a more precise caliper 1st. Once that's done I'll do some more experimenting with lead bullets.

[tx gunrunner]

I built this rifle to shoot cast bullets only .. I won a lot of matches and trophies with this gun . I even make a lot of my bullets molds I shoot in my guns too . Here is 2 of them I make .

[JEBar]

interesting points raised .... it may well be that if I was into long range competitive shooting, I'd look at things differently .... a while back I purchased a Lewis Lead Remover .... while using it I have been pleasantly surprised at the fact we simply don't have any build up in our Redhawk .... as already noted, it has been heavily used with both lead and jacketed bullets .... that may well be due to the fact that I'm not talking about high speed bullets on par with those fired in our 300 WBY .... the only rifles in which I have fired lead bullets are our Henry 44 Mag and 45-70 .... so far the majority of the rounds fired in them have been lead but a large number have been jacketed .... no issues so far

[tx gunrunner]

I've had a Lewis Lead remover for over 40 yrs .I only use the forcing cone tool for cleaning and polishing the forcing cone . .

Here is the rifle I built for that 400 gr 40 cal bullet mold . You can't buy this brass you must make it . The 40-60 Maynard was sniper rifle in the Civil War and was one of the 1st cartridge in the Civil War

[JEBar]

thanks for the picture and info .... moving to larger caliber, lead, high grain, slower speed bullets for hunting is an alien concept for me .... historically, I've used jacketed, high speed, flat shooting bullets .... when it comes to punching paper, I've always used whatever I could shoot the cheapest

[tx gunrunner]

Some of my hunting guns when I was able to hunt . My patched round ball in muzzle loader runs almost 2,000 FPS and drops a Tn deer dear in it's tracks .

[Travlin]

Excellent work tx gunrunner
Could you please give a brief explanation of the mold making operation? Do you have to make a cutter (cherry?) that is exactly like the bullet or is it done in several gradual steps? Thanks

[tx gunrunner]

Excellent work tx gunrunner
Could you please give a brief explanation of the mold making operation? Do you have to make a cutter (cherry?) that is exactly like the bullet or is it done in several gradual steps? Thanks

I chuck a old single cavity 30 cal bullet in a 4 jaw chuck and find center and then square up the mold which is the hardest part . I drill it for like a 32 or 40 cal . I made a tool to cut the nose and another tool to cut grease bands and another one for the rear band . My molds are cut to 4 different dia in each mold . And being lathe cut the are perfectly round and if they are center and square the bullets will fall out of mold . If there not square or centered you will need to beat them out like the mold that are cherry cut mold like Lee , Lyman and RCBS . Here 2 more I cut . Remember these bullets must be pan or hand lubed since each bullet band are different sizes to fit in a bore , free bore and rifling .

[JEBar]

I can only admire the level of expertise required to build your own molds ....

[Travlin]

Outstanding work and thanks for the photos and explanation. The great barrel maker Harry Pope used to make lube pumps for the bullets that fit his barrels.Did you ever use a false muzzle with your muzzle loading rifles and if so was it worth it for improved accuracy?

[tx gunrunner]

Outstanding work and thanks for the photos and explanation. The great barrel maker Harry Pope used to make lube pumps for the bullets that fit his barrels.Did you ever use a false muzzle with your muzzle loading rifles and if so was it worth it for improved accuracy?

I owned #425 ballard made in 1906 made by Harry Pope with false muzzle and all the loading tools , bullet mold and pump in 32-40 . It was in new condition and A buddy in San Diego own it now . I also own the book about Pope barrels too which I sold with gun . I lost all my pics in a computer of that gun when a computer when south .

[tx gunrunner]

Did you ever use a false muzzle with your muzzle loading rifles and if so was it worth it for improved accuracy?

I forgot to answer this part or your question . If you are shooting black powder Yes .. With smokeless powder there is no advantage and it just slows you down and your condition keep changing because you are to slow .

[Travlin]

tx gunrunner, Thanks for the reply. Did you ever shoot the 32-40 maybe with black powder? I understand some very tight 200 yard groups were shot with a 32-40 many many years ago.

[Travlin]

PS: That must have been a special experience to hold a rifle that Pope had made the barrel for.

[tx gunrunner]

PS: That must have been a special experience to hold a rifle that Pope had made the barrel for.

The rife was design to offhand shooting and it was little long for me to shoot offhand but it was super on the bench . It
fit my buddy Russ perfect who owns it now . I mirror my #3 to hold and feel like the Pope but to fit me . note the Pope type loading tool and palm rest. My ballard was like the in pic but no scope with all the tool and I had a the Pope nose pour bullet mold not pictured not pic .

[Travlin]

Most Excellent work. Thanks for posting. I fear that your level of craftsmanship is almost lost . I am glad to see what a real gunsmith can do. Start with steel and a good piece of wood for a stock and end up with beauty and precision. The only other time that I have seen this level of skill was in the building of my friends two bore cartridge rifle. Thanks again for sharing and the photo of the the target.