Henry Rifle Forums

Ban on guns in post offices is unconstitutional, US judge rules

https://www.usnews.com/news/top-news/ar ... udge-rules

Some interesting info about "Going Postal". From 2011:

https://www.todayifoundout.com/index.ph ... ng-postal/

Also, the author of the USNews article states that Bruen 'expanded' gun rights, which is incorrect and misleading. Bruen opened the door for the restoration of the entire range of the 2nd Amendment, not just firearms. There is a difference.

One cannot fully understand how fundamental to our Republic the 2A is, without understanding the Declaration of Independence.

In a discussion with the local Sheriff back in VA years ago, he pointed out that not only could you not carry into the post office, but you couldn't legally have your firearm in your vehicle in the parking lot of the Post Office,which was also Federal Property. We lived in a Rural Farming Community and the Sheriff had gone to school with Miss Tina. He was all the way Pro 2A; but was warning us because of certain elements in the area that might use this segment of the law to their advantage.

I had often wondered why certain high profile citizens in the county parked across the street from the Post Office and walked over to check their boxes, or parked next door in the back lot of the flower shop and jumped down from the dividing wall and into the Post Office Lot walking in to conduct their business, then out to the front walk, across to the flower shop and back thru the side drive and back to their vehicles.

BrokenolMarine wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 15, 2024 7:51 am

In a discussion with the local Sheriff back in VA years ago, he pointed out that not only could you not carry into the post office, but you couldn't legally have your firearm in your vehicle in the parking lot of the Post Office,which was also Federal Property. We lived in a Rural Farming Community and the Sheriff had gone to school with Miss Tina. He was all the way Pro 2A; but was warning us because of certain elements in the area that might use this segment of the law to their advantage.

I had often wondered why certain high profile citizens in the county parked across the street from the Post Office and walked over to check their boxes, or parked next door in the back lot of the flower shop and jumped down from the dividing wall and into the Post Office Lot walking in to conduct their business, then out to the front walk, across to the flower shop and back thru the side drive and back to their vehicles.

The sheriff may have been mistaken about the parking lots. Just like the post office and national park buildings you cannot carry them. However, in national parks you can carry on the grounds and parking lots. The laws only prohibit caring in the post office building interiors. I have worked in many of them with a permit for DC, MD, and VA. I just had to leave my gun in my vehicle locked up.

Handloader wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 15, 2024 8:33 am

BrokenolMarine wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 15, 2024 7:51 am

In a discussion with the local Sheriff back in VA years ago, he pointed out that not only could you not carry into the post office, but you couldn't legally have your firearm in your vehicle in the parking lot of the Post Office,which was also Federal Property. We lived in a Rural Farming Community and the Sheriff had gone to school with Miss Tina. He was all the way Pro 2A; but was warning us because of certain elements in the area that might use this segment of the law to their advantage.

I had often wondered why certain high profile citizens in the county parked across the street from the Post Office and walked over to check their boxes, or parked next door in the back lot of the flower shop and jumped down from the dividing wall and into the Post Office Lot walking in to conduct their business, then out to the front walk, across to the flower shop and back thru the side drive and back to their vehicles.

The sheriff may have been mistaken about the parking lots. Just like the post office and national park buildings you cannot carry them. However, in national parks you can carry on the grounds and parking lots. The laws only prohibit caring in the post office building interiors. I have worked in many of them with a permit for DC, MD, and VA. I just had to leave my gun in my vehicle locked up.

There's a number of oddities with that Federal law regarding USPS and the Federal law. For example, it's perfectly legal for a FFL dealer to ship a gun via USPS to another FFL in any other State. And there are quite a few military installations that sell firearms, ammo, etc. to active, retired, and reserve; as well as allow married residents who live on base to keep their guns in their quarters. There are other examples, but those will do for now. Seems the rules don't apply evenly.

GunnyGene wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 15, 2024 10:46 am

Handloader wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 15, 2024 8:33 am

BrokenolMarine wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 15, 2024 7:51 am

In a discussion with the local Sheriff back in VA years ago, he pointed out that not only could you not carry into the post office, but you couldn't legally have your firearm in your vehicle in the parking lot of the Post Office,which was also Federal Property. We lived in a Rural Farming Community and the Sheriff had gone to school with Miss Tina. He was all the way Pro 2A; but was warning us because of certain elements in the area that might use this segment of the law to their advantage.

I had often wondered why certain high profile citizens in the county parked across the street from the Post Office and walked over to check their boxes, or parked next door in the back lot of the flower shop and jumped down from the dividing wall and into the Post Office Lot walking in to conduct their business, then out to the front walk, across to the flower shop and back thru the side drive and back to their vehicles.

The sheriff may have been mistaken about the parking lots. Just like the post office and national park buildings you cannot carry them. However, in national parks you can carry on the grounds and parking lots. The laws only prohibit caring in the post office building interiors. I have worked in many of them with a permit for DC, MD, and VA. I just had to leave my gun in my vehicle locked up.

There's a number of oddities with that Federal law regarding USPS and the Federal law. For example, it's perfectly legal for a FFL dealer to ship a gun via USPS to another FFL in any other State. And there are quite a few military installations that sell firearms, ammo, etc. to active, retired, and reserve; as well as allow married residents who live on base to keep their guns in their quarters. There are other examples, but those will do for now. Seems the rules don't apply evenly.

It use to be the base commander decided the rules of carrying on base. For example I could carry certain firearms on Fort Lewis if they were registered on base. I often did because they had a great range. I have Military ID with PX, COM and MWR privileges.

The laws have gotten ridiculous. After an incident at the Richmond VA hospital involving three employees, where two males shot one another in the parking lot over a female employee, the Chief of the VA Police BANNED firearms from VA property, including the Parking Lots. Miss Tina and I worked with the VA through several Charities, one which we started and ran for six years that took the vets kayak fishing, another which taught fly tying, fly fishing, and took them on fly fishing trips called "Healing Waters." We also built fly rods in that Charity. A third group was a recumbent biking group, "Bent Riders." I had run into the Chief often.

I had a conversation with the Chief about the unfairness of penalizing the VETS driving to the VA for treatment by prohibiting them from locking the weapons in their vehicles. Especially when we have veterans driving in from other states and into the bad area where the VA Hospital was located. This was especially unfair since the incident triggering the action involved three employees and NO veterans. His response was that he as afraid someone would leave a firearm in plain view and it would be stolen and an incident would occur. "You know many of our veterans suffer from PTSD and the sight of a firearm in the vehicle could trigger that response."

I suggested that his officers might spend more time patrolling the parking lots to protect the property of the vets and insure this didn't happen instead of flirting with the secretaries and desk clerks in the clinics, hanging out in the snack bars, or hanging in the hallways hitting on the veteran's wives. ALL of which we had received complaints on from vets in our various groups. Politician that he was, he was unmoved and the rules remained in place. The ONLY persons authorized to lock firearms in vehicles were uniformed sworn officers who were prohibited from bringing their firearms into the VA unless they were FEDERAL officers. VA Police were the only armed officers on the property.

Sir Henry wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 15, 2024 11:09 am

It use to be the base commander decided the rules of carrying on base. For example I could carry certain firearms on Fort Lewis if they were registered on base. I often did because they had a great range. I have Military ID with PX, COM and MWR privileges.

That's still the case, but the fact the Base CO is the issuing authority results in a lot of confusion every time someone transfers in from another location or there's a change in issuing authority, which happens frequently. Our local AFB usually has a change of command every year or 2. And since DODD 5210.56 is unevenly applied due to different State level laws, that also effects how the Base CO interprets his authority. We have a lot of AF trainee pilots here in MS (permitless carry State) that end up in CA or some other very restrictive State and it's a real hassle for them, since they can buy guns here that are totally forbidden by their next State & therefore by the base.

Beyond the above, it's all a giant mess that is absolutely not necessary, or even marginally effective for the intended purpose of preventing bad things from happening.

Yup, a real hassle. When we left VA there had been a shooting on Quantico Marine Base, a Domestic thing. So, of course the Base Commander banned all non military firearms from the base for those NOT living in base housing. Prior to that you could lock unloaded firearms in the trunk of the vehicle. Many of the military bases now ban personal weapons from the base. This prevents those who need to come on the base for Medical, Dental, or to use the facilities such as the Exchange or Commissary from protecting themselves during the trip to and from the bases, therefore many decide NOT to use the base facilities available to them. NOT worth the risk in today's environment.

Well what you can't see you can't see.

BrokenolMarine wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 15, 2024 3:46 pm

Yup, a real hassle. When we left VA there had been a shooting on Quantico Marine Base, a Domestic thing. So, of course the Base Commander banned all non military firearms from the base for those NOT living in base housing. Prior to that you could lock unloaded firearms in the trunk of the vehicle. Many of the military bases now ban personal weapons from the base. This prevents those who need to come on the base for Medical, Dental, or to use the facilities such as the Exchange or Commissary from protecting themselves during the trip to and from the bases, therefore many decide NOT to use the base facilities available to them. NOT worth the risk in today's environment.

Unfortunately, I don't think it's going change anytime soon regardless of what happens with the USPS ruling.

fortyshooter wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 15, 2024 4:31 pm

Well what you can't see you can't see.

Military bases still conduct random vehicle searches at the gates, sometimes with a dog.

GunnyGene wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 15, 2024 5:55 pm

fortyshooter wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 15, 2024 4:31 pm

Well what you can't see you can't see.

Military bases still conduct random vehicle searches at the gates, sometimes with a dog.

... and a felony conviction can cost you your military benefits, or at least your VA benefits.... just not worth the risk for me.

fortyshooter wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 15, 2024 4:31 pm

Well what you can't see you can't see.

Until you are tagged for a random vehicle search. They routinely stop and search random vehicles entering the base. Being caught with an unauthorized weapon in your vehicle would certainly result in forfeiture of on base privileges, and could possibly involve a federal criminal charge. I've been the subject of one of these searches several times over the decades. I never had anything in my car that I shouldn't, but I know for a fact that anytime I enter the base, I could be directed over to the side and be subject to a vehicle search.

Not worth it to me.

clovishound wrote: ↑

Tue Jan 16, 2024 9:33 am

fortyshooter wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 15, 2024 4:31 pm

Well what you can't see you can't see.

Until you are tagged for a random vehicle search. They routinely stop and search random vehicles entering the base. Being caught with an unauthorized weapon in your vehicle would certainly result in forfeiture of on base privileges, and could possibly involve a federal criminal charge. I've been the subject of one of these searches several times over the decades. I never had anything in my car that I shouldn't, but I know for a fact that anytime I enter the base, I could be directed over to the side and be subject to a vehicle search.

Not worth it to me.

About 10-12 years ago, a few installations around the country experimented with allowing personal firearms on base for trips to the Commissary, etc. as long as they were locked up and you had a military ID card. Went on for about a year, IIRC, and then the brass got nervous about it.

The thing that really sucked was that all the LE Firearms Instructor classes I took were held at Quantico on the FBI ranges. Those are located in the middle of the base. I wonder how those would be affected by the new rules. I guess with confirmation letters from the class you'd be fine, otherwise they might stroke out with several handguns, an M4, shotgun, and scoped bolt gun and a couple thousand rounds of ammo in the trunk during a gate search. LOL.

Well, our base has a skeet range. I have used it several times. You are fine if you use the designated gate, have your shotguns unloaded, separate from the ammo and in the trunk, and tell the gate guard what you have, and are going to the skeet range. I never had an issue other than one new guy on the gate having to ask his supervisor. Supervisor said, no problem and we went on our merry way.

FT. Meade MD has a range and if you belong to the rifle and gun club you can use it. Also, FT. Gordan GA you can use the range with Mil ID and register your arms.

Constitution? It is a nice document.