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Handgun stances & grips - discussion
Posted: Fri Oct 30, 2020 3:04 pm
by GunnyGene
A discussion on stances & grips. The good, the bad, and the ugly.
Excerpt:
https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/anyon ... /#comments
My shooting stance got the job done, but it still earned the rod of correction from an instructor. “Pull your weak-side arm in a little. Elbow pointing down now. Flex the strong side arm a little. There.”
Noticing the pained expression on my face as I tried to aim using the position she demanded, my teacher laughed. “Yeah, the Weaver kind of sucks, doesn’t it?” she said, shaking her head as she turned to attend to another student.
In turning so abruptly, she missed my arched eyebrow.
The class was the Massad Ayoob Group’s MAG-20 Range course, offered by NG Investigations in Ocala, Florida. It definitely was not Gunsite Academy, the originator of the Modern Technique of the Pistol, a big part of which was the Weaver Stance; strong side foot to the back, knees unlocked, bladed torso, weak arm bent sharply downward, strong arm straight but with unlocked elbow, isometric push-pull grip on the pistol.
Re: Handgun stances & grips - discussion
Posted: Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:29 pm
by RanchRoper
I am somewhere between Gene Autry and Don Knott’s.
Re: Handgun stances & grips - discussion
Posted: Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:11 pm
by Headhog
I've been shooting handguns for fun and competitively for 40 years. During that time I've used a lot if different stances depending on what discipline I was shooting. For the most part, for action shooting (USPSA or IDPA), I like the Isosceles stance. It allows even movement to the left or right. When I shot PPC the Weaver Stance worked very well. It's just a matter of adjusting your stance to the shooting conditions.
Paul
Re: Handgun stances & grips - discussion
Posted: Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:15 pm
by markiver54
Weaver has always worked well for me, however , it does depend on the situation IMO.
Re: Handgun stances & grips - discussion
Posted: Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:43 pm
by GunnyGene
markiver54 wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:15 pm
Weaver has always worked well for me, however , it does depend on the situation IMO.
Indeed it does. A couple videos from Rob Leatham illustrates this. These are not about the hardware, but about using (or not using) it. only a few minutes each.
Grip:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4yOIL40dcQ
Stance:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HW6dKcW6qmY
Sights:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=li0rGtXh23I
Re: Handgun stances & grips - discussion
Posted: Fri Oct 30, 2020 9:11 pm
by RetiredSeabee
I have never been aware of my "stance". I have been in ranges and noticed someone who was obviously in a planned stance. They just looked awkward to me. And watching them shoot didn’t result in any noticeable accuracy or consistency on their target. Of course I had no idea how long they had been practicing the particular stance but it just never looks natural to me.
Now as for grip I have learned a lot from discussion on line from a handful of shooters that I respect. One being our very own North Country Gal. Another was our friend Texas Gun Runner. Depending upon which model gun I pick up their advice comes to mind. And if I am shooting and not having a good day I mentally rewind a few pointers from them and usually get results.
I guess that if I were training specifically for self defense combat shooting I might put more thought into a practiced stance. But for now being comfortable with how I handle the gun and hitting what I point it at in as small a group as possible works for me.
Re: Handgun stances & grips - discussion
Posted: Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:43 pm
by markiver54
Thanks for the videos Gunny.
Have always had a lot of respect for Rob Letham. He used to shoot AND win competitions with my favorite 686 revolver!
Re: Handgun stances & grips - discussion
Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2020 7:49 am
by GunnyGene
markiver54 wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:43 pm
Thanks for the videos Gunny.
Have always had a lot of respect for Rob Letham. He used to shoot AND win competitions with my favorite 686 revolver!
He is a believer in the KISS principle.
Hang on to the gun, keep it steady on the target, pull the trigger. Not complicated.
And get off the X if you're about to be trading bullets.
Re: Handgun stances & grips - discussion
Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2020 12:08 pm
by clovishound
I was trained in the military to use the Weaver stance. I switched to the isosceles later on.
Either one works, as do some others. It's more about what you are comfortable with, and what works for you.
I like the isosceles because you just naturally face something you are confronted by.
Re: Handgun stances & grips - discussion
Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2020 12:31 pm
by fortyshooter
Whatever is comfortable, steady and lets me stay on target.
Re: Handgun stances & grips - discussion
Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2020 11:41 am
by BrokenolMarine
We taught the isosceles and modified weaver in the academy, but leaned heavily toward the first for two reasons. Keep in mind, I am speaking from a working prospective not competition here.
1. When wearing body armor and/or anyone thick in the upper body to start with, might find it hard to to hit a solid modified weaver, impossible to achieve a full weaver stance.
2. Most importantly, the armor protects well in the front and rear, but is venerable from the sides, especially in the armpit area. Taking a modified weaver stance to challenge a possibly armed suspect, raises the arm on the suspect's side exposing exactly the most venerable area you want to protect. The isosceles turns the vest, and any trauma plate to the threat.
The interview stance taught in the academy was basically a weaver stance, but if my guys had to draw, we encouraged the to draw on the move, creating distance. They could move back into the isosceles.
Since the rule was always "In a crisis situation you will react in the way in which you train," and I looked at all my competitive shooting as training, I shot isosceles in matches as well.
Re: Handgun stances & grips - discussion
Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2020 2:24 pm
by GunnyGene
BrokenolMarine wrote: ↑Sun Nov 01, 2020 11:41 am
We taught the isosceles and modified weaver in the academy, but leaned heavily toward the first for two reasons. Keep in mind, I am speaking from a working prospective not competition here.
1. When wearing body armor and/or anyone thick in the upper body to start with, might find it hard to to hit a solid modified weaver, impossible to achieve a full weaver stance.
2. Most importantly, the armor protects well in the front and rear, but is venerable from the sides, especially in the armpit area. Taking a modified weaver stance to challenge a possibly armed suspect, raises the arm on the suspect's side exposing exactly the most venerable area you want to protect. The isosceles turns the vest, and any trauma plate to the threat.
The interview stance taught in the academy was basically a weaver stance, but if my guys had to draw, we encouraged the to draw on the move, creating distance. They could move back into the isosceles.
Since the rule was always "In a crisis situation you will react in the way in which you train," and I looked at all my competitive shooting as training, I shot isosceles in matches as well.
I would advise taking any stance/grip as a suggestion if you happen to be vertical. Which you may not be. You may be asleep at home, relaxing in your lazy boy, sitting in your car, etc., and likely won't be wearing body armor unless you are a leo, and even they don't wear it to bed.
Those are all situations which happen fairly often, and which most people have never been trained to respond to. Something to think about.
