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"Too much" is dangerous, but "not enough" can also be dangerous !

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Ojaileveraction
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Re: "Too much" is dangerous, but "not enough" can also be dangerous !

Post by Ojaileveraction » Fri Dec 21, 2018 6:04 pm

clovishound wrote:Color me a little skeptical on the light load detonation theory.

If it were a real issue, I would think that black powder cartridges, like .38 and .44 would have easily identifiable issues.
Black powder cartridge loading has its own issues. Having a gap between bullet and powder is one.
As to smokeless Lever Gun Performance Studies, http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm, "The Use of Pistol Powders in Rifle Cartridges" gives some info on light load detonation.
It's pretty dense.
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Re: "Too much" is dangerous, but "not enough" can also be dangerous !

Post by Flinch » Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:00 pm

I used the data on this website to develop light loads for my 1888 Trapdoor and was able to develop accurate loads. >> http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm That being said, I have experienced high pressure when loading light charges for .38 Special PPC loads for my revolvers. Every so often it sounds like a Magnum cartridge is being fired and the primers on the hot rounds are flattened.

IMHO the big concern is with bottle neck rifle cartridges. I contacted Hodgdon by telephone and spoke with a gentleman about loading light charge weights in 30-06 cartridges with IMR 4895. Hodgdon H4895 is made in such a way that you can get away with loading at 60% of the published maximum charge weight for a particular cartridge. The rep from Hodgdon cautioned me about trying to reduce charge weights below the published recommended minimum charge weights with any powder other than H4895, because I could experience a "burning excursion." While trying to develop an accurate lower recoil cartridge, I pulled bullets from Greek HXP 30-06 ammunition and reduced charge weights to 80% of what was in the cartridges. I experienced delayed ignition when firing the rounds out of my M1 Garand and on occasion it sounded like a .300 Winchester Magnum was fired.

I haven't blown a handgun or rifle to kingdom come, but I have been worried a few times while experimenting with reduced charge weights in bottle neck rifle cartridges. As a rule of thumb, I stick with published minimum recommended charge weights when loading bottle neck rifle cartridges. Light loads in straight wall cartridges is another story.
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Re: "Too much" is dangerous, but "not enough" can also be dangerous !

Post by JEBar » Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:36 pm

Flinch wrote:I used the data on this website to develop light loads for my 1888 Trapdoor and was able to develop accurate loads. >> http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm

thanks for the link .... fascinating .... loading so few grains (like 8 - 12 gr of Unique) in such a large 45-70 case really has me wondering .... depending on how the ones I've loaded using IMR 4198 work out, I will most certainly give some of these loads a try

just curious, what worked best for you .. :?: .. thanks again
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Re: "Too much" is dangerous, but "not enough" can also be dangerous !

Post by Flinch » Mon Jan 07, 2019 6:10 am

Ojaileveraction posted the link before I did.

I am using small charges of HS-6 with 350g and 405g Laser Cast bullets for my Trapdoor loads. Accuracy at 50 meters is surprisingly good and recoil is not bad. I am not seeing any signs of overpressure. I also see decent groups with Unique.

Trail Boss gunpowder has a noticeably louder report and accuracy is not as good, so I am sticking with HS-6 for now.
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Re: "Too much" is dangerous, but "not enough" can also be dangerous !

Post by Mistered » Mon Jan 07, 2019 9:50 am

My 44th edition of the Lyman Reloading Handbook shows a lot of reduced loads using Unique.
If anyone would like data for one of these loads let me know - i'll scan the page for the cartridge and send it.
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Re: "Too much" is dangerous, but "not enough" can also be dangerous !

Post by BruniX » Wed Jan 09, 2019 1:31 am

Flinch wrote:I used the data on this website to develop light loads for my 1888 Trapdoor and was able to develop accurate loads. >> http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm That being said, I have experienced high pressure when loading light charges for .38 Special PPC loads for my revolvers. Every so often it sounds like a Magnum cartridge is being fired and the primers on the hot rounds are flattened.

IMHO the big concern is with bottle neck rifle cartridges. I contacted Hodgdon by telephone and spoke with a gentleman about loading light charge weights in 30-06 cartridges with IMR 4895. Hodgdon H4895 is made in such a way that you can get away with loading at 60% of the published maximum charge weight for a particular cartridge. The rep from Hodgdon cautioned me about trying to reduce charge weights below the published recommended minimum charge weights with any powder other than H4895, because I could experience a "burning excursion." While trying to develop an accurate lower recoil cartridge, I pulled bullets from Greek HXP 30-06 ammunition and reduced charge weights to 80% of what was in the cartridges. I experienced delayed ignition when firing the rounds out of my M1 Garand and on occasion it sounded like a .300 Winchester Magnum was fired.

I haven't blown a handgun or rifle to kingdom come, but I have been worried a few times while experimenting with reduced charge weights in bottle neck rifle cartridges. As a rule of thumb, I stick with published minimum recommended charge weights when loading bottle neck rifle cartridges. Light loads in straight wall cartridges is another story.
thanks a lot, Flinch,
this is exactly the type of information I was looking for (and suspected, because I would have been tempted by very low loads, but the Lee moddern reloading was reporting this stuff)!
thanks also for the link ....
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