Chronograph testing with .44 Magnum Speer 200gr Gold Dot

[DAVIDF]

I tested a couple of loads yesterday with Speer's .44 Mag 200gr Gold Dot bullets. These are designed for .44 Special or low velocity lite recoiling .44 Mag loads. The velocity envelope for proper expansion is supposed to be 800fps to 1100fps. However, below 850fps expansion is probably iffy. This bullet works really well between 1000 to 1100fps. I wanted to develop two loads for defense. One specifically for my 3.75" barreled Ruger Super Blackhawk Bisley that would produce between 1000 to 1050fps. The second would be a compromise that may work best in my Henry Big Boy Classic with a 20" barrel, but also have enough velocity to perform good in the Bisley. I hand weighed each charge with my Lee scale. I had loaded these rounds prior to discovering that this scale is very inaccurate and instead of being within +/- 0.1 grains, it is probably closer to +/- 0.3 grains. Fortunately, these loads are well away from max pressure. Both of these loads use Red Dot powder, WLP primers, and Starline Brass. They were lightly crimped in the crimp groove with an OAL of 1.61".

The first load is with 6.8gr of Red Dot.

Bisley

1 - 884
2 - 908
3 - 919
4 - 915
5 - 927
AV - 910
ES - 43
SD - 16

Henry

1 - 931
2 - 981
3 - 1002
4 - 996
5 - 1008
AV - 983
ES - 77
SD - 31

ES and SD were not good with these, particularly with the Henry. Could be the inaccurate scale or could be that this is not the best combination of components at that powder charge. The good part is that the difference in velocity between the Bisley and Henry is pretty small. So, I can increase the velocity in the Bisley without driving the bullet too fast out of the Henry. I have some loaded with 7.2gr of Red Dot that I did not test. They may end up being pretty close to a perfect compromise.

The second load is with 8.2gr of Red Dot. This one is intended for the Bisley.

Bisley

1 - 1024
2 - 1003
3 - 1063
4 - 1050
5 - 1036
AV - 1035
ES - 60
SD - 23

Henry

1- 1187
2 - 1174
3 - 1169
4 - 1170
5 - 1184
AV - 1176
ES - 18
SD - 8

ES and SD was not good in the Bisley but very satisfactory in the Henry despite my lousy scale. I may have gotten lucky and chose five rounds where the scale actually worked correctly. Too bad that this is probably a bit too fast for the best bullet performance out of the Henry. But, Gold Dots are pretty tough and sometimes when driven fast they get mangled pretty good but shed an insignificant amount of weight.

Both of these loads have been accurate at close range, 15 yards or so, despite horrible ES and SD with some. I have not tested them at longer range. I'll wait to get a good scale first as it is probably pointless at this time. Both have been extremely soft shooting as well. The 6.8gr load feels like almost no recoil out of the Henry, yet the bullet would work quite well at that velocity.

I love having a load that works great in both my revolvers and my Henry. These results look promising so far, at least as far as velocity. I think a charge of 7.2gr to 7.6gr will be the perfect compromise as long as I can get good accuracy.

[JEBar]

I'm looking forward to your reports as to their effective range

[DAVIDF]

I pulled up a ballistics calculator. If I use a muzzle velocity of 1050fps and the ballistic coefficient that Speer claims of 0.145, and plugging in typical Florida atmospheric conditions (80 degrees, 80% humidity) velocity would be 850fps at 180 yards. That is still within the velocities that it will expand ok. At 100 yards velocity would still be 922 fps. Plenty fast for it to work well. It will be interesting to test it at 100 yards for accuracy once I get a good scale.

[JEBar]

interesting indeed .... looking forward to reports on your continued research

[Squatch]

Interesting. I like shooting 44 mags in that range. I have worked up several light loads that work well around 1,100fps.

Same for the 45/70.

[JEBar]

I've pretty much come full circle with ammo for our Henry 44 Mag but not so much with our 45-70 ....historically, I've been a proponent of the practice with what you hunt with line of thinking .... with both our Henry and Ruger Redhawk 44 Mags, our hunting round has been and so far as I'm concerned will continue to be centered around using a Nosler 240 gr JHP ..... a while back I tried to switch to lead bullets with lower powder charges and frankly, that ain't for me .... on the ranges I frequent, I really enjoy firing at 75 to 125 yards .... the drop of the lead bullets is more than I am willing to put up with .... I have no interest in having to adjust scopes depending what ammo I'm using .... once the lead bullets I have on hand are gone, I hope there won't be any more .... the recoil from full power hunting loads fired from our Redhawk is much different than that from our Henry .... as to our 45-70, the jury is still out .... the difference in recoil from hunting level and cowboy action level ammo is considerable .... my hunch is that once hunting level loads (I anticipate 3) I won't be firing the 45-70 anywhere near as often as I will the 44 Mag .... with that being the case, I really don't have much use for cowboy action loads

[DAVIDF]

I love light loads out of the Big Boy and my Super Blackhawks. And I see your point about having to go back and forth with adjusting sights. I would like to develop one light load that is capable of doing anything I will want to with my Henry and Super Blackhawks. But one of the requirements is that it also be economical. If the price were not a consideration, I would have probably already settled on the WFNGC 250gr bullet from Beartooth. At $31 per 100 that one is out of the question. I intend on trying Penn Bullets 245gr Thunder Head. http://www.pennbulIets.com/44/44-caliber.html. I have spoken with Bob Palermo and a few have tried the .45 version in the lever guns and they were able to get them to cycle/feed ok. He hasn't received any feedback with the .44 version. If I can get them to feed well in my Henry and get good accuracy, then that would be a do all bullet for my purposes. Unless I get into cowboy action shooting The RNFP bullets I have been using feed so smoothly and I don't expect these to feed really well, but it is worth a shot. That super wide meplat of about .424" would make a great hunting bullet.

Once I settle on one bullet and one load, I will file on the riser of the rear sight so that I know exactly which notch to use for each distance. There is quite a bit of change in trajectory for each notch and these slow moving loads have quite a bit of drop between 50 and 100 yards.

Squatch, around 1100fps seems to work really well with plated bullets and the Henry. The cast seem to do better with a bit more velocity in my limited experience with different powder charges. I need to use such a lite charge of Red Dot to keep a 200gr cast bullet near 1100fps that I am not sure that it will work well with the components I am using. A lot of soot on the exterior of the Starline brass already with a 6.8gr charge and I would have to go down to probably 6.0gr to 6.5gr to keep it near 1100.

[JEBar]

well understood on $$$$ being a factor, it is for me as well .... the thing that has helped me is finding a cheaper (19 cents each) source of Nosler 240 gr JHP bullets (first link below) ... that places the difference of only 3 cents between the Nolser JHP's and Cabela's 16 cents each for Oregon Trail cast 240 gr bullets .... for me the advantages of firing jacketed bullets makes 3 cents something I can live with .... when I need to restock, I'll probably order from Rose Distribution (second link below) has 240 gr jacketed bullets available in bulk packs for just under 14 cents each


http://www.shootersproshop.com/nosler-p ... 100ct.html

http://www.rozedist.com/mm5/merchant.mv ... =ZBJ-44MAG

[DAVIDF]

Thanks for the links. They had some Nosler 10mm bullets really cheap that I was thinking about. They don't have them as cheap now. I'll have to keep checking.

Now you've given me another option with the Zero bullets. That is not as cheap as Penn's 200gr RNFP, but cheaper than the Thunder Head. Might be really good accuracy with them sized at .431.

[JEBar]

we use the heck out of 158 gr 357 bullets from Rose, still have a couple of thousand in our storage area .... in our Henry 357 and Ruger GP100's they fire identically to Nosler's 158 JHP's