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45-70 load development

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JEBar
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Absolute and Final Plans

Post by JEBar » Tue Jul 04, 2017 4:17 pm

DISCLAIMER : routinely, my absolute and final plans are subject to change at any second and usually do .. :oops:

every since buying our Henry CCH 45-70 I've researched the different loads I want to come up with .... 45-70 is a truly versatile and for me, intriguing, caliber .... with light loads it can be fun to fire in recreational shooting and in Cowboy Action settings .... loaded to the gills, it can and has taken all of Africa's big .... just to make it clear, I do not have any illusions that I will ever need it while hunting elephants, grizzlies, or any other such critters .... even with that being the case, my intention is to put together a series of loads that are capable of punching paper with minimal recoil to knocking down an elephant ....

1... for paper punching I project keeping 200 to 500 on hand :

I plan to load Oregon Trail 350 or 405 gr lead bullets ===>http://www.cabelas.com/product/Oregon-T ... ullets[url][/url] ... or Missouri Bullet Company lead bullets in the same size range ===> http://missouribullet.com/details.php?p ... &keywords= .... most likely we will go with Oregon Trail because we can get them at Cabela's which saves shipping charges .... we have well over 2,000 on hand right now .... after those are gone the decision as to which to purchase will be governed mostly by cost, the cheaper the better


2... for hunting I project keeping 20 or so on hand :

I plan to load bullets of 3 different weights :

300 gr Combined Technology (CT) Ballistic Silvertip Bullet (a joint effort between Nosler and Winchester) ===> https://www.natchezss.com/nosler-ballis ... 50-ct.html .... we have a couple of hundred on hand

400 gr Barnes .45-70 Government Bullets Jacketed FN FB ===> https://www.cheaperthandirt.com/product ... 6458844.do .... 200 on hand

500 gr Acme Bullet Co. Grain RNFP hard cast coated bullets ===> http://www.acmebullet.com/bullets-reloa ... uct_id=446 .... 200 on order
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BigAl52
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Re: Absolute and Final Plans

Post by BigAl52 » Tue Jul 04, 2017 4:26 pm

Jim
I bought some Meister 350 grain bullets to give a try for plinking. I like the looks of them and the fact they had 2 larger grease grooves. Im taking a week off next week and me and the all Weather have some loads to test. I will let you know my findings. I have some loads with 5744 and IMR 4198. I also have some Berrys 350 copper coated to try. Hope I didnt casue you any anguish here forcing you to change ur mind. Al
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JEBar
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Re: Absolute and Final Plans

Post by JEBar » Tue Jul 04, 2017 4:36 pm

BigAl52 wrote:Jim
I bought some Meister 350 grain bullets to give a try for plinking. I like the looks of them and the fact they had 2 larger grease grooves. Im taking a week off next week and me and the all Weather have some loads to test. I will let you know my findings. I have some loads with 5744 and IMR 4198. I also have some Berrys 350 copper coated to try. Hope I didnt casue you any anguish here forcing you to change ur mind. Al
for paper punching have no preference and all recommendations are appreciated .... for those loads I may go with Unique or some other cheap, easy to find powder .... for hunting loads I plan to begin with IMR 4198 .... if it flat our doesn't work for our rifle, I have no clue what I'll try next .... for an additional level of hunting ammo, if anyone runs across any 600 grain'ers I'd sure like to hear about it
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JEBar
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Re: Absolute and Final Plans

Post by JEBar » Fri Jul 07, 2017 6:44 pm

shown below (left to right) .... Nosler 300 gr ballistic silver tip ---- 400 gr Barnes .45-70 Jacketed FN FB .... 500 gr Acme Bullet Co. Grain RNFP hard cast coated bullets

links related to above bullets found in opening post in this thread .... each of the 3 will be loaded to the Max .... should be interesting
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170707 002 45-70 Hunters 44 001.jpg
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Re: Absolute and Final Plans

Post by Ojaileveraction » Fri Jul 07, 2017 10:49 pm

I'm looking forward to seeing your progress.
For Cowboy Action type loads
I found Lever Gun Performance helpful.
http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm

I'm wondering most about the 500gr coated bullet. My research has cast doubt about a 500gr bullet fitting in a lever action.
Most of all it won't cycle through the magazine.
You may be able single load them but they won't fully extract. Had that happen to me with a bolt action 30-30 that I loaded using spitzer bullets.
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JEBar
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Re: Absolute and Final Plans

Post by JEBar » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:40 pm

I had the same concerns and guess time will tell .... what I have been lead to believe is they can't make a jacketed 500 gr that will work but it is possible with a 500 gr solid lead bullet .... as best I can measure, the 500g is 1/8th of an inch longer than the 400g .... as of right now, I can't say if that will matter or not .... if they end up not being good for use in our Henry, I know they can be used in a Ruger #1
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Re: Absolute and Final Plans

Post by JEBar » Sun Jul 09, 2017 9:10 am

Ojaileveraction wrote:I'm wondering most about the 500gr coated bullet. My research has cast doubt about a 500gr bullet fitting in a lever action.
Most of all it won't cycle through the magazine.
I'd love to be able to say I knew this all along but that wouldn't be the case .... take a look at the crimp ring on the (left to right) 300, 400, and 500 gr bullets shown below ....they are located on each bullet so that when crimped, the shell's OAL will be the same .... with that being the case, fitting in a lever action's magazine shouldn't be an issue .... the best loading data I've found for the 500 gr coated, cast bullet comes from RCBS as listed on page 40 in "The Complete Reloading Manual for the 45-70 Government" ===> https://www.amazon.com/Complete-Reloadi ... B004JOGNQS .... for Marlin Model 1896 Standards (which Henry has adopted) they list 4 different powders, for a 507g cast bullet .... since I have some on hand, I plan to start with IMR 4198 .... minimum load 30 g <muz vel 1254 fps> / maximum load 32 g <muz vel 1337 fps> .... over time I've come to highly respect RCBS .... I'm looking forward to getting some put together
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170709 001 45-70 Hunters Crimp Rings 001.jpg
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Ojaileveraction
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Re: Absolute and Final Plans

Post by Ojaileveraction » Sun Jul 09, 2017 6:38 pm

I missed that. Great info! Thanks.
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Re: Absolute and Final Plans

Post by ssonb » Mon Jul 10, 2017 11:00 am

I am using a 225 gr .457 pistol bullet that is Powder coated that brings its dia. up to slightly above .458. With a load of 11.5 gr unique it pushes out at 1300 fps , These bullets print almost at the same POI as the 405 gr Oregon trail bullets traveling at 1325 at 75 yards. Out of my cch 45-70 there is almost no recoil. I suspect that these bullets in Cowboy action would be perfect.... The bullet is from a mold that is for the Ruger old army conical. Oh btw I have fired these loads with no filler in the case, and have found no deviation in performance from powder position.. as a matter of fact I need to cast ,coat and load a bunch more cause I shot them all up this weekend.
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Re: Absolute and Final Plans

Post by JEBar » Mon Jul 10, 2017 10:57 pm

preparations to begin reloading for our 45-70 continue .... the pictures below show them with a 30 caliber 180 grain spitzer bullet and a Nosler 44 caliber 240 grain JHP .... the pictures do not do justice to the real size and weight difference ..... I'm looking forward to getting some loaded and sent down range
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170710 001 45-70 compare 003.jpg
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170710 002 45-70 compare 002.jpg
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