410 handguns/rifles

[JEBar]

info passed on as an FYI .... during a recent conversation with a friend who happens to be an excellent gunsmith, I learned that many people who have rifled handguns or long guns chambered for 45LC and/or 410 shotgun shells have been surprised to learn that shooting lead shot will quickly lead their barrels .... the reason being the soft nature of shotgun pellets as opposed to higher quality cast bullets ... he said he's had several customers who brought in Judges, Circuit Judges, Governors, Heritage single actions, and derringers saying that they were no longer accurate when shooting 45LC .... he went on to say that in every case the problem has been a heavy lead buildup in their barrels .... he went on to say that in their test shooting as little as one box of 410 lead shells can build up a sufficient coat to affect the accuracy of 45 bullets .... having a gun shop clean lead of such barrels cost the customer +/- $300 .... he recommends a thorough inspection and cleaning after each session firing shotshells .... he went on to say that one solution is "Polygonal rifling" but that is a more expensive isn't often used ====> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polygonal_rifling

[markiver54]

Thanks for the heads up Jim. Have often considered a Judge.

[North Country Gal]

Back when I was shooting Contenders, the 45/410 barrels were very popular, but most folks used them for shooting 410s, not 45 Colt. The problem in those 45/410 barrels was lack of accuracy for 45 Colt, but not because of leading. The big issue was the long jump for the 45 Colt bullets to travel in those chambers cut for the much longer 410. When we went hunting for a 45 Colt barrel, we had to find a 45 Colt, only barrel, but one that had not been cut to also shoot 410s. This was sometimes difficult, because a lot of owners of 45 Colt, only barrels reamed them out to also shoot 410s.

I suspect you'll have the same issue of 45 Colt accuracy for the same reason in the case 45 Colt/410 revolvers, but, of course, those are self-defense guns for up close work and hair splitting accuracy of 45 Colt isn't needed. Just don't expect the same kind of accuracy you'd get in a standard 45 Colt, only, revolver, regardless of the leading issue.

[markiver54]

Makes a ton of sense! Thank you NCG!

[ol'pole]

don't shot shells have hulls that carry the shot in the barrel ? I don't reload shot shells but my brother in law did and always has hulls, is it different for revolvers ?

[JEBar]

don't shot shells have hulls that carry the shot in the barrel ?

good question .... I had to look it up .... after running several different searches, I haven't found any cutaway 410 pictures showing a full length wad .... I did see some offered for sale by Mid South ....

[JEBar]

Just don't expect the same kind of accuracy you'd get in a standard 45 Colt, only, revolver, regardless of the leading issue.

that makes sense to me ....

the following is taken from a Truth About Guns article .... https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/gun-r ... erringers/ .... with all of their disadvantages, Bond derringers appear to fire decent groups at the 7 yard distance that they are designed for from their 2.5" and 3" barrels

" “Precision” is not the word that comes to mind when I think of a derringer, but the Bond guns do better than you would think. Using the 3″ .45 Colt barrel, 3″ five-round groups seated off bags were easily doable at a 7-yard distance. This is what I am used to with my 3 1/2″ barrel as well.

I found the manufacturer as well as bullet weight or charge made very little difference in group size. The limiting factor is an extremely short sight radius, non-adjustable sights, and limited purchase on the gun. Seated with the 9x19mm and shooting off a front bag, 3 1/4″ groups at 7 yards using the diminutive 2.5″ barrel were the norm.

Some rounds packed more punch than others, but none seemed to be much better or worse when it came to accuracy. Again, the limiting factor are the sights.

Note that, as mentioned in my earlier review, you’ll need to mind the barrel position when it comes to point of impact. The top barrel will shoot a 3.5″-ish group, and the bottom barrel will shoot a 3″-ish group. But each group will be a little distance between each other, somewhat depending on barrel length and caliber. I found that the 3″ .45 Colt barrels shoot about 9″ apart at 7 yards. "

[220]

Note that, as mentioned in my earlier review, you’ll need to mind the barrel position when it comes to point of impact. The top barrel will shoot a 3.5″-ish group, and the bottom barrel will shoot a 3″-ish group. But each group will be a little distance between each other, somewhat depending on barrel length and caliber. I found that the 3″ .45 Colt barrels shoot about 9″ apart at 7 yards. "

Do they even regulate derringers like they do double rifles.
Most double rifles are regulated for a specific load at a set distance it can be a very time consuming and costly exercise.
I would imagine with cheap derringers designed to be used at touching distance it is probably a case of a rough bore sight at best before the barrels are fixed.

[Cowboy Gun Fan]

Other than a Derringer, I don't believe I would want to use a 410 in a 45 Colt. Anytime I considered a 45 Colt Rifle or Revolver, the thought of using a 410 in it really never crossed my mind.

[North Country Gal]

The 45/410 thing actually started with the Contender back in the 70s. At that time, using shotshell loads in revolvers was a big deal and very popular. When TC started doing the 410/45 thing, I believe they were actually taken to court on the legality of shooting shotgun ammo in a handgun, but since the 45/410 barrels had rifling, they were deemed legal for shooting 410 shells. By the way, at the time, TC also made a wide selection of "hotshot" barrels for shooting shot loads in pistol calibers such as the 357, 44 mag, 45 Colt and so on.

Many of these barrels were fitted with shot tubes. These were not chokes, as some believed. They were threaded on sections with straight rifling to reduce the spin of the shot charges caused by the rifling. That spinning of the shot charge produced groups with large holes in the center. With shot tubes, barrels could give decent groups out to about 15 yards in the case of the 410. I actually used some 410 Contender barrels for rabbit and squirrel hunting, back in the day. The one BIG caveat was to remove the shot tubes when shooting standard bullets. A spinning bullet hitting that straight rifling in he shot tubes abruptly would cause jarring recoil you would not soon forget.